shipping FO

[Lightning Bug]

I mailed one FO at our post office and they said it had to be land sent and not priority mail as the liquids were flammable. I said that the candle supply companies use this way to mail, but they refused and mentioned maybe they shouldn't. For that matter, paper is flammable also...but have any of you heard this before? TIA. Beth

[k0mptec]

alot of us have that same problem, I just omit the fact that it is liquid when I ship....Love your name by the way!!

[gloworm]

USPS gives lots of headaches to mailing FO. It depends on the flashpoint. Over 200 is Ok for USPS but certain Postmasters still give us trouble. Anything 150 and above (I believe it's 150 or 152) but below 200 has to be sent via UPS. Ups has no airmail restrictions on FP in these ranges. We dropped one Fo from our line when we found it's FP was 114. Too much hassle to ship.

Glo

http://www.backwoodsfragrancesupply.com/page2.html

[Lightning Bug]

Like the name too...except when I was little and in grade school, the teacher would always say...you must write your full name. And I would have to argue that I was just "plain" Beth. Come to think of it, I never was a raving beauty! LOL. Beth

[Lightning Bug]

Glo, That makes a lot of sense. Thanks. Beth

[scentsme]

On many suppliers sites, you'll see a note after certain fragrance oils, stating that those particular oils can only be sent via ground service due to low flashpoints.

[Beth-VT]

Anything 150 and above (I believe it's 150 or 152) but below 200 has to be sent via UPS.

Actually, that's not true. You can send lower flashpoints via USPS as long as you follow protocol, I do it all the time.

Here's good thread we've already covered on this subject http://www.candletech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16771&highlight=flashpoint

and here's my take:

They should have a problem with it, if they're doing their job correctly

You can ship liquids, but they need to be packaged properly. Tall mentioned using click-n-ship- to avoid the admition of liquids, but there is a serious reason for the limits, and the heat/engine/scenario is the perfect example. How would you feel if a plane goes down because your box of seemingly harmless FO's happened to leak....get's too close to a heat source, catches fire, and, well......it's not far fetched.

Flashpoints below 141 are considered flammable, from 141-200 are considered combustible. All liquids are supposed to be declared, and the PO should be asking about flashpoints. There are regulations requiring specifics in packaging liquids, enough to absorb and contain any and all fluids should a leak arise.

Here's a quick synopsis, as well as the full link:

http://pe.usps.gov/text/dmm300/601.htm#wp1065027

Quote:

Flammable and Combustible Liquids (Hazard Class 3)

10.13.1 Definitions

The terms used in the standards that apply to hazard class 3 are defined as follows:

a. Flammable liquid means a liquid that has a flashpoint of not more than 141°F (60.5°C), or any material in a liquid phase that has a flashpoint at or above 100°F (38°C).

b. Combustible liquid means any liquid that does not meet the definition of any other hazard class and has a flashpoint above 141°F (60.5°C) and below 200°F (93°C). Note: A flammable liquid with a flashpoint at or above 100°F (38°C) that does not meet the definition of any other hazard class may be reclassified as a combustible liquid per 49 CFR 173.120(.

10.13.2 Flammable Liquid Mailability

Flammable liquid is prohibited in international mail. Flammable liquid with a flashpoint of 20°F (-7°C) or below is prohibited in domestic mail. Other flammable liquid is prohibited in domestic mail via air transportation but is permitted via surface transportation if the material can qualify as an ORM-D material and meet the following conditions as applicable:

a. The flashpoint is above 20°F (-7°C) but no more than 73°F (23°C); the liquid is in a metal primary receptacle not exceeding 1 quart, or in another type of primary receptacle not exceeding 1 pint, per mailpiece; enough cushioning surrounds the primary receptacle to absorb all potential leakage; the cushioning and primary receptacle are packed within a securely sealed secondary container that is placed within a strong outer shipping container; and each mailpiece is plainly and durably marked on the address side with "Surface Only" or "Surface Mail Only" and "ORM-D" immediately following or below the proper shipping name.

b. The flashpoint is above 73°F (23°C) but less than 100°F (38°C); the liquid is in a metal primary receptacle not exceeding 1 gallon, or in another type of primary receptacle not exceeding 1 quart, per mailpiece; enough cushioning surrounds the primary receptacle to absorb all potential leakage; the cushioning and primary receptacle are placed within a securely sealed secondary container that is placed within a strong outer shipping container; and each mailpiece is plainly and durably marked on the address side with "Surface Only" or "Surface Mail Only" and "ORM-D" immediately following or below the proper shipping name.

10.13.3 Combustible Liquid Mailability

Combustible liquid is prohibited in international mail. Combustible liquid is permitted in domestic mail if the material can qualify as an ORM-D material and meet the following conditions as applicable:

a. For surface transportation, if the flashpoint is 100°F (38°C) but no more than 141°F (60.5°C); the liquid is in a metal primary receptacle not exceeding 1 gallon, or in another type of primary receptacle not exceeding 1 quart, per mailpiece; enough cushioning surrounds the primary receptacle to absorb all potential leakage; the cushioning and primary receptacle are packed in a securely sealed secondary container that is placed within a strong outer shipping container; and each mailpiece is plainly and durably marked on the address side with "Surface Only" or "Surface Mail Only" and "ORM-D" immediately following or below the proper shipping name.

b. For surface or air transportation, if the flashpoint is above 141°F (60.5°C) but no more than 200°F (93°C); the liquid is in a primary receptacle not exceeding 1 gallon per mailpiece; enough cushioning surrounds the primary receptacle to absorb all potential leakage; the cushioning and primary receptacle are packed in a securely sealed secondary container that is placed within a strong outer shipping container; and each mailpiece is plainly and durably marked on the address side with "ORM-D" or "ORM-D AIR," as applicable, immediately following or below the proper shipping name. Mailable material sent via surface transportation must be marked on the address side as "Surface Only" or "Surface Mail Only." For air transportation, each mailpiece must bear a shipper's declaration for dangerous goods.

c. For air or surface transportation, if the flashpoint is above 200°F (93°C) the material is not regulated as a hazardous material. Such nonregulated materials must be properly and securely packaged to prevent leakage under the general packaging requirements in 2.0, Packaging.

[Lightning Bug]

Thanks for all the info. I, too, feel we must say what's in our boxes for, as you stated, it would be horrible to cause a mishap. I guess it is ok to send them ground USPS and it just takes a bit longer. So that is how I'll go for light boxes and UPS for heavier if the flashpoints permit. Thanks again. Beth

[gloworm]

Ok for more Correct (LOL) info I checked with my son-whose brain retains more important info than mine does now-

140 FP and under are hazardous...141 to 200 are

combustible for USPS and need ORM-D forms...under 140 need metal

containers double packaged. UPS is so much simpler for anything under 200 no forms, no special packaging, no declaring as hazardous or combustible, just package and go. Also many postmasters are not sure of correct procedures either which makes for many problems. We live in an area whare we can easily post at 4 different offices, the closest postmistress gives us problems and insists on all the red tape for ALL of our FO's even over 200 which we know are OK to go regular mail. The other 3 offices have no concerns about it. I understand the reason for concerns and we want to ship our Fo properly but it can get confusing. We also have the occasional person who asks us to ship illegally "because other companies ship it to me that way". Sorry but we will not do that.

Also anything under 200 is prohibited in international mail.

Glo