Violetsexoticcandles

Starting burning the 3 1/2" container with a CSN 16 today...not waiting since I want to test burn more than HT. First burn it was a huge flame (no different than Cotton, CD, LX or RRD wicks). Same shell on top with MP underneath. 2nd burn into it at 2 hours, and still a huge flame although it's probably 1/4" shorter than it was the first 30 minutes. So far the container is still just barely warm to the touch, same after the 1st 4 hours. Since these wicks are specific to palm wax, I think it's just the nature that this wax burns with a huge flame. I know for sure I won't be making any palm pillars anytime soon, the containers are hard enough to wick. One thing I can say about these wicks, I got a tiny, tiny shroom on the first burn and nothing now. They do self-trim, but the flame stays really straight so they aren't burning to one side like most self-trimming wicks. Not really sure I like them any better than cotton wicks.

I hear you. So far I've only successfully wicked a 16 oz mason and a 5 oz bulb jar. That took 6 months! Still working on the pillars (along with a ton of other projects).

That my wax would talk to me BEFORE I put in the FO and dye.

And if it ever does - THE BACK DOOR IS MINE!

Ugh if my wax started to talk to me, I would know that I was truly losing my mind! LOL. *faint*

My one "CANDLEMAKING" Christmas wish would be that I would guess the right size/type wick on my FIRST test burn!!!!

I got that last week! I made a ball candle out of ecosoya PB with English Garden FO from CS and used a zinc wick (size 60 something). It burned very nicely and left a perfect shell that I am sure will be great to stick a tealight in once it's burned all the way.

My one Candlemaking Christmas wish would be to finally be able to wick my palm pillars! LOL.

Try red and brown. Or even add a bit of brown to the purple, if it's a rusty colored brown.

When I first started out, I ordered from them quite a few times- I got my first soy from them and a lot of FO's that I still use. Most of their FO's are really great- like Ocean (my FAVORITE), white tea & ginger, awapuhi seaberry, sunflower... It's been a while, but I think their fo's are great. I've tried other FO's, but looked and didn't recognize the names. I think they changed their line a bit. I don't buy much from them anymore because of shipping costs, though... But would if I were going to reorder some of the FO's that I originally got when they run out (ocean's already out ).

Violet

Hi,

What size wick is that and size jar? It looks like an 8 oz metro. I used a CD 14 in mine (after being frustrated to no end with others) and it worked great flame wasn't high at all.

Good luck!

I like that idea...you'd think I'd learn to just chuck things instead of wasting perfectly good fo in them! I've got tons of crap made with V1 that I now have to push off on my family!!

I have tons of tarts made up that I'm thinking of selling for 25 cents each lol. At least I'll make my $ back. It's just an aggravation, though...

I can't wait til I can buy a larger amount of Ecosoya PB. It makes great pillars, tarts and votives.

They could probably help most by taking the product off the market. Folks like Timothy Murphy are handsomely compensated by a multibillion dollar industry. Why should small candlemakers with limited resources be squandering their time and money trying to make this crap work, or resorting to the inventor just to get a votive to come out right?

You know, soy isn't just a cute, cantankerous thing that we have fun trying to "master". Sometimes things like V1 and Ecosoya CB-Advanced have to be called what they are -- crap products -- and chalk up another snowjob from the soy wax manufacturers.

At this point in time it's like a bad pizza place in the middle of New York City. No matter how many people try it and never come back, they do well because there are countless new customers walking down the street (and maybe a few regulars who've never tried good pizza).

They won't take it off the market until every single penny they put into it is brought back. It's a nice thought, though... would save others a lot of time and wasted energy... plus $. But gotta love the capitalistic nature of the few who thrive on the plenty.

I use metal molds as well, and the most recent batches of V-1 have given me darn near nothing but grief. If you can make it work with tarts, more power to you, and I hope you can have better luck with the tarts than I am, because it stinks to anguish over it. After I use up this last bit, I'm done with V-1.

I hear you... just can't say I've had the same problems... But I, too, am done with V1 once my stuff is gone.

Waxed bears, anyone? LOL.

Poor bears. Sigh.

Just to run with that a little bit...

Things can be easier when you're satisfied with an average result. Even then it can be a lot of work. When you imagine a really excellent product, perhaps better than what you've seen, you can't overestimate the amount of work involved. People say test, test, test but I'm not sure how many understand what that really means.

It's a given that this is going to take a lot of time and money. The crucial thing is feeling that the investment has resulted in the products you envisioned, or at least that you're on the road. However, it's easy to misjudge the difficulty of dealing with the variables. Small changes in the design can make a big difference in your results and it's not always predictable. It's easy to get confused.

If you put in a lot of effort but find yourself lost, it might be time to step back from working on products and instead work on a methodology for developing products. You need a process to follow that guarantees you'll inevitably reach your goal without getting too confused along the way.

I find two things are required for that. One is a very organized plan for methodically and incrementally exploring the variables. The other is a really meaningful way of recording the results. Not just notes, but all the relevant data for each tester and each burn in quantitative form. Something you could possibly plug into a spreadsheet. Plus think about everything that makes you happy (or not) about the performance of the candle and make sure it's recorded somehow, preferably as a number. After each tester is burned you should be able to paint a detailed picture of how that candle worked no matter when refer back to it.

A system like this will let you accumulate a database showing the effect of changing different variables and allow you to find your way to the results you want.

I don't know how relevant these thoughts are to you, but hope it helps in some way.

Top, you sound like a statistics professor, and no offense, but it's hard for some people to understand. I took it for my MS and I can understand it to a degree, but a lot of people may not. Even then, it makes my head hurt thinking about variables (too much time spent in stats!!!). We don't all think in numbers.

I take very detailed notes on most things I'm working on- like, for instance, palm candles- they are very hard to wick. Or a new soy wax. I write down the wax, FO, scent, wick, size of jar or pillar, etc... I take everything I can think of, every variable, into consideration. Write everything down.

I'm a bit disorganized, so sometimes, I write it down on scrap paper and staple it into my notebook. But in the end, if I go months without testing that particular candle, scent, wick, wax, etc., at least I've got my notes. And something to go on.

Like my English mentor told me, KISS. We cannot all think like Einstein, nor can we all converse about the meaning behind Milton's Paradise Lost. But in this forum, we're chandlers.

I don't think Ocean wants to discuss variables, at any rate. I think that Ocean is worried about the money put into the business, which can, if one is not careful, become exhorbitant.

Also, I've never been happy with average, when it comes to me or anything I produce. I can't see anyone who really cares about their end-result being happy about being average. Those who really care will soar above the average, yet still, depending on those variables you mention, be unsuccessful.

I don't know.. most of us don't run to the computer to input numbers in order to gauge success or failure. I know when I'm spending more than earning...

A lot of people would not know how to build a database to measure. If you have one designed, perhaps some may be interested, purely for the sake of measuring.

I work in research and work with numbers every day. Numbers can only say so much...

I have had these very same thoughts this week, because indeed, the market is saturated... it's expensive to market, time consuming to do so, as well as test every scent and wax you want. I've also come to the conclusion that I've really expanded way to fast and am tightening my products down to a few that I know sell. It's hard this time of year, though, when everyone wants holiday scents. But, that being said, if you can mix and blend, find something unique, whether it's a scent, shape, size, etc...

Just a thought I've been having. I've definitely learned a lot doing this. I can't get the bug outta me, though, so I'll continue. But although I filed as a business owner last year through my county, I'm considering it a hobby- something that keeps me enthusiastic. It seems whatever sales I do make are spent on more wax, FO, etc... But hey, I enjoy it. And to me, having gone through a lot in my life (bad relationship, divorce), if it makes me happy, I can't be sad.

Now if I can only get back to writing again.

Do what your heart tells you and try not to let anything get you down.

Why not PM Tim from NatureWax or email them about your complaints? Perhaps they could help?

They came on this board not too long ago, didn't suggest anything but to pump their new blends.. After all the time I've already wasted, I'm just done.

V-1 is no good for tarts, either, if you ask me. I haven't tried every.single.thing I can think of, I don't guess - I haven't tried stearic, for instance. But I've added coconut oil, I've added C-3, I've warmed the molds, I've not warmed the molds, I've cooled 'em in the oven, I've poured warmer, I've poured cooler, and still the little suckers crack. Some crack all the way through, or break into pieces when I take them out of the molds. I had a good batch earlier as well, but all the recent ones I've gotten have sucked big dirty rocks. I've probably got about 18 pounds on hand, and I'm going to suck up and make it work for tarts, do what I have to to get them to turn out at least saleable, but I'm switching. I'll test the Ecosoya since it's gotten good reviews, but it's no fun making tarts when I'm wincing, wondering how badly the latest batch will crack.

Hmm... never had a problem with tarts. I use the metal molds.

Yes, when all else fails (as in the V1 wax ) there are always firestarters or tarts. The Ecosoya makes a nicer looking pillar anyway.

Hehe... yes, I made a few ball candles with Ecosoya PB (isn't there some sort of abbreviation like V1 has... lol?) and they were spectacular! I made a ball mold, I think 6 oz, zinc wicks, made a perfect shell and I am so confident that when it's done burning, I will have a pillar I can stick a tealight in.

I think I'll liquidate the crap on Ebay... or dip some bears, etc... Don't have to worry about cracking there! It's a good wax for bears. Hehe.

I hate V-1 too so you're not alone...I luckily only got 1 10lb. bag of it and made tarts with the rest of it. I've fiddle farted around with it for votives and was a huge waste of time.

Yah I hear you! And, the funny thing was, when I started out, it wasn't bad, but apparently, Nature Wax doesn't care, either. They sell so much C3 and don't move as much V1, so screw those who would like to offer votives/tarts on a regular basis. Yah, sure, a lot of votives and tarts can be made out of a 50 lb box... they don't expect as many orders... but still. Do they think they'll really sell any blend they have coming, if they won't stand by the brand they already have or make good with a crap-blend?

I bought my last 50 lb box last spring and found out late this summer that the batch was already expired. I was told that the expiration date would not affect the results I was getting, even though every batch was cracking unless I turned on my poor oven and BAKED my votives. I've come to the conclusion that maybe expiration date expired= bad wax.

At this point, I'm even considering changing container waxes once my C3 is done, because I'm very disappointed in their customer service.

Sad thing is, I took this out on my supplier, when she contracted with Nature Wax, and I feel she is just as much a victim as me and many others.

LOL, the sweet perfume of truth wafts through the veggie forum.

:laugh2::laugh2::laugh2:

Yes indeed!!!!!

Anyone want some tarts? Har har...

I've been screwing with this wax for months. I had a good batch last fall- don't know what happened. I still have around 18 lbs of this wax and the only way to use it for votives is to majorly mess with it... tried everything- the box, the oven, stearic, 10% C3...

I made votives this weekend for orders and it took me 5 tries to get them right. Basically, the only way to get them to NOT crack is to cool them in a warmed oven. And, that does not keep them from cracking further on down the line- I've had to scrap quite a few I poured months ago. Then, there's the frosting.

Now, one could say, well, that's soy, etc...

BUT, I have been playing with Ecosoya PB and none of these issues have presented themselves.

V1 is good for tarts, only, in my opinion.

What shall I do to use the rest of it up? Try to sell a crapload of tarts on Ebay so I can order Ecosoya PB? GRR...

Just venting. Don't really want more advice on V1. It just stinks.

I agree with the CSN14. I get a nice shell that eventually melts down near the end of the candle.

Looks Great! Palm is very addictive.

Stella recommended a CDN 14, did you mean to type CSN? Totally dif wicks.

It is actually for a mini status jar 3 oz, but only really holds about 2 oz of wax. I'm doing a couple of weddings that both want these to use as favors...one wants palm wax and the other soy. It's the palm wax that worries me because if I don't put it in the oven to set up, it doesn't crystalize properly.

I've tried both ways with my glass glow- putting them in the oven, and just putting them on a rack (placed on top of a large baking dish) with a box or large rubbermaid container over them.... The wax set up nicely, with beautiful crystals.

I'm assuming you've tried the box method?

Is it for tealights if so here's the link http://www.wickcenteringtool.com/default.asp?S=503&A=E&PKV=TLWCT-1|0

Hope this helps

Those look really cool. I hate it when I have like 100 tealights to make and I have to hover over them... but, I rarely have to make that many at once.

I don't think tealights are what she is talking about, though- no way they hold 2 oz of wax. Maybe a small hex jar?

What about the larger craft sticks? I use them- my son drilled holes in them for me and I just wait for the wax to set up a bit, then put the wick through the hole, bend the wick over the stick a bit... then occasionally peek at them to ensure none are wandering. I think they're about 2" wide. I got mine at AC Moore, but they sell them at Walmart sometimes, too... and other places. Only thing is they are a bit long. Maybe they could be cut in half or something so that they aren't taking too much room up.

If I come across anything, I'll post again

Good Luck!

Vi, CS is not a distributor of NatureWax, but they DO distribute Ecosoya.

When having problems, first check the handling sheets from the NatureWax website or email them. The temperature at which V1 is poured is pretty critical.

Bunkie, the handling sheet says:

I know that- I'd emailed Mike at CS because I wanted to know if Ecosoya had any 'issues' prior to sampling it. But his tips did help, to a certain degree.

So darn cute, I am sure they will be a great seller.

Really? I just made this one for my aunt, since she ordered a bunch of candles for me.

It would be a way for me to rid myself of that darned V1, though!!!!!! :laugh2:Don't gotta worry about cracking issues when dippin bears.

There's a lot to think about tho- I made a big mess with this bear. lol... I had to scrape wax off of a lot of stuff. Plus, even tho he was a dollar store bear, gotta add in the cost of the hat, the basket, the wax & FO... I've seen them selling on ebay for anywhere from $5.99 to $19.

Who knows.

Thanks, Stella. I've tried the C-3 and had no noticeable improvement with that. I guess my next step is to try the stearic acid and see what that does, if anything. It's just frustrating, because when I first started, it worked SO WELL!!! Not flawless, but nowhere near the cracking problems I'm having now.

I talked to Mike @ Candlescience about my frustrations w/V1 and he said to use 10% C3 and no stearic. Tried that and it worked, but only if I poured and cooled them in a warm oven. I made some last week w/out cooling in the oven and they cracked like crazy.

I'm just gonna use up the V1 and switch. I played with the V1 for so long trying to make it work and barely anything did... not worth it, really, especially when I don't have to do S*hit to Ecosoya PB to get it to work for me.

Does it release as easily as the V-1? If it does, and my little batch of V-1 that I've got on the way doesn't work any better, I may be looking to switch as well.

Yes, it does. I am not sure where you get your V1 from, but my supplier already told me that Naturewax isn't going to try to work out the issues (search the forums for Naturewax's own comments) because they don't move enough of it... That is really why I'm not bothering with it.

I'm just curious - has anyone gotten a new batch of V-1 since we were all posting about having problems? I've got a new (small) batch on the way and I was wondering if anyone had also ordered more and whether you'd seen any improvement.

I haven't- I don't trust it anymore. I have to mess with the stuff I have (still have like 30 #) until it's gone, then I'm switching to Ecosoya PB. My votives and tarts all come out smooth with EPb.