Another wax being discontinued at CS?

[evergreen]

I've been trying to determine what type of wax I'd like to focus on for pillars and novelty shape candles.

I've read all the posts in the veggie wax forum about Palm wax being discontinued at Candle Science. Candle Science is already my main supplier since I'm on my fourth order with them. My paraffin order came in yesterday. One of the waxes that I bought is IGI 1274--I love mottled affects. (Palm wax is my other favorite and, that's being discontinued at CS...) So--I just thought I'd look up the data sheet at CS and must not have noticed last week that IGI 1274 is being discontinued. I must say that I'm pretty frustrated by this since I checked the shipping on a case through Peak to my east coast location and it was $50 while CS was $33. (I'm trying to plan for the future since buying in ten pound sample sizes is getting expensive.) I really like CS but the fact that the two waxes I wanted to work with are being discontinued is really irritating me right now.

Can anyone tell me if IGI is discontinuing 1274 mottling wax or is this just a product buyer choice at CS? Is there another mottling wax available on the market that people can suggest? If I should just make my own mottling wax with a carrier oil and base paraffin, which wax would you suggest?

[radellaf]

I've emailed about them, as my experiments with 1343 trying to get it to behave like 1274 have been completely unsuccessful. I had mottling _nailed_ with 1274, 0.5% micro wax (prevent seeping and sagging), and 1% stearic (to increase mottle). Haven't tried 1343 in the same mix but really shouldn't have to. If either should be dropped, it's the 1343.

Anyway, while waiting for an answer, any mottled candle fans here with some formulas that work well with 1343?

Using it straight I got all sorts of shenanigans, like 2-2.5" pillars needing oversize LX-18 wicks just to burn right. (Lx-12-14 should have been enough).

[Traveler]

Check with Aztec (www.buywax.com). It's listed under Pillar Wax. :-)

I have started getting more supplies from Aztec now that CS has started dropping items.

It was just incredibly frustrating to lose my Palm wax supplier right in the middle of the holiday season with orders pouring in from customers. So I'm a bit leery of CS right now. The upside is that Aztec has been good to work with and you should find their shipping rates comparable to CS....I hope!

Good luck!

[radellaf]

I live 15 min from CS, so even shipping from TN would be a killer.

Fortunately, the two test candles I made with the 1343, using my 1274 recipes, look and act just like 1274. 1% stearic, 0.5% 5715, 3% FO, 2.5" LX-16 is burning _perfectly_. The 2% stearic 2.25" one has only been lit an hour or so but so far so good, which is more than I could say for my past experience using the wax straight.

I must have had a really bad slab that one time. I understand the mottling properties are essentially "not guaranteed" to be there, but all the batches should at least burn decently.

Edited January 17, 2011 by radellaf

[Traveler]

@Radellaf - CS has also stopped selling Stearic. (In case you were getting it from them as well).

[radellaf]

Yeah, I was, that's lousy of them. At least a 1 or 2 pound bag of that lasts me a long time so I can get some next time I order something from CandleWic or Peak.

It's like all they want to support is soy wax containers, which are my least favorite type of candle. I wonder what's going on, and suspect the economic depression has got them financially strapped to the point they're cutting whatever they can. Proof of that will be seeing what comes back to their catalog when the economy improves.

On the good side, I have such an inventory of wicks, 1274, feather palm, paraffin container wax, molds, and FO that apart from stearic I don't think I'll be buying much of anything this year. Maybe a silicone or urethane mold or two.

[Pam W]

I've emailed about them, as my experiments with 1343 trying to get it to behave like 1274 have been completely unsuccessful. I had mottling _nailed_ with 1274, 0.5% micro wax (prevent seeping and sagging), and 1% stearic (to increase mottle).

I've been using 1274 for some time now and I add NOTHING other that 1% polyboost 150 for add'l FO retention. I get a perfect, full mottle on every candle.

[radellaf]

Thanks for the suggestion... or "Oh great, more wax additives to try" (I've got a small collection)

If the descriptions I'm reading about Polyboost 130 (non mottle) and 150 are anywhere close to reality, then they sound like all any candlemaker could possibly need.

Hard micro is pretty effective on non mottles, but even the softer micro at 1% does inhibit mottling a little. Of course, for a partial mottling look, sometimes you want something to do that, in small amounts. Do you ever go for the partial look?

[Pam W]

Personally, I do not like the partial mottle look unless it is consistant throughout the candle but if it clustered - then it's a remelt :smiley2:

http://www.craftserver.com/forums/showthread.php?t=72464

Edited January 18, 2011 by Pam W

[Candybee]

Have you tried checking into the waxes at C&S in PA? They carry both the mottling and palm waxes you want and their shipping is fast and very reasonable.

[cybersix]

This is so strange.. I can't believe CS is dropping so many supplies.

My feeling is they are discontinuing so many things because of economy not only for environmental reasons.

If it was for that they should close and stop doing business, so they are sure they are not going to do anything bad for the entire environment.

[Wessex]

I think any company that is making money on a product will continue carrying it. So I guess they were either losing money or decided the money was needed for another product. Can't really blame them. I was definately irritated when they discontinued Palm wax. I think they probably took a big financial hit with the bad batch fiasco. But they have great customer service, super quick shipping (next day for me), and alot of good FO's. So I hope they stay around for a long time.

Cheers,

Steve

[lovemylabs]

I agree Steve. I think all of us have carried things that we thought would move in our area, only to find out they are slow movers or not moving at all and eventually have to clearance the stock just to get rid of them. So that could be the deal for them too. I also hope they stay around for a very long time. We are one day shipping from them as well and I love em'. The only time I order from another company is if CS doesn't carry the product or if an oil is not quite the "real deal". And, there's very few of their oils that I've been disappointed in.

[radellaf]

I've been using 1274 for some time now and I add NOTHING other that 1% polyboost 150 for add'l FO retention. I get a perfect, full mottle on every candle.

"Let It Shine" is the only thing that comes up on Google, do you know if they're the only USA supplier?

Bitter Creek's "Mottle Max" has a very similar description, but the thread I looked up on here just discussed using it with mottling container wax. I have some of that (IGI 1288) from a CS clearance sale, but it's working great without additives. Well, other than that CS's Red Hot Cinnamon oil seems to completely kill mottling in pillars or containers, but the Dragon's Blood ones look and burn nice.

Still trying to find a place to sell a $5 bag of stearic for less than $10 shipping...

I have got some good info talking to actual people at CS, but the tech support line gave me nothing but the info off the label about 1274/1343 differences, and wouldn't cop to the reasons for the massive list of newly discontinued items other than "not selling enough". The critical issue is how well does it need to sell to carry it, and whether that's become more strict because of the economy, which is relevant to customers because it says something about whether any of the products might come back in a few years. But, no, they completely denied it. (Well, I hope the econ is back in a year or two, since I used to make a living at electronics engineering, and my experience and research into selling candles makes me think they'll never be a viable main profession for me.)

Edited February 22, 2011 by radellaf

[Pam W]

"Let It Shine" is the only thing that comes up on Google, do you know if they're the only USA supplier?

Your are right - LIS is the only place that I can find it for less than buying a 50gal drum!! GL used to sell it but they are out of business so that just leaves LIS. I get a great mottle with the 1274 and use the poly150 only to increase FO retention.

[radellaf]

Thanks for the quick reply. I look forward to trying it.

In the meantime I got an answer that MottleMax = Polyboost 150, and the supplier is a little closer to NC so hope I saved a little in shipping for that plus a few lbs of stearic. I may not need the stearic + micro combination if the polyboost is better, but I figure it's still good for 7/8" tapers.

I rarely put more than 3% fragrance, but without the micro (or candlechem translucent crystals), or more than 2% stearic (which kills mottle), I can't get 1274 to hold more than 1-2% of many fragrances.

The 1% stearic with the micro is just to increase mottle. I made one with just micro and 5% fragrance and got lots of mottle but OMG scent overload

Had to resist temptation to buy a 5" 3-wick mold... I'm doing fine with wick pins in 4" 3-wick candles in a sealed up 1-hole mold, but it's just tempting to keep going bigger. Might as well go all the way if I do, though. I picked up a 6" (or 7"?) 3-wick for a few bucks at a clearance sale and one day will give it a go. Have to be multilayer as I use 2lb pour-pots.

[Pam W]

It's been a while since I poured my 7" monster but if I remember, I used 3 62z. I also tried it once using Eco 8 and placed the wick so that the curl leaned in a circular pattern. There was still more waste with both types of wicks than I liked tho. With that said, mine still did better than Wal-mart specials :smiley2:

Poly150 is supposed to allow for 8% FO load but I could never achieve that in 1274 without oozing -5% is about all I can do even adding some stearic to the mixture. But I figure if an FO requires more that 4-5% load to get a decent throw then it isn't worth it's price.

[radellaf]

My mold is a 6" x 6.5" so probably about 5 lbs of wax.

1274 is .485 oz/in3 * 184 in3 = 5lbs 9oz.

Nice 3-layer 3-wick with my 32oz pour pots.

No idea how I'd wick it. Probably with the same LX-18 that I use with 3" single wick candles but that might be big. 4" 3-wick uses LX-10, which is on the small side even for a 2" candle (and 2.25" needs LX-14). So for all I know a 14 or 16 would be enough. LX-12 3-wick 4" is very hard to not get it melting through the side. You have to run a bunch of 1-hour burns to get it to tunnel, then it sometimes behaves.

Imagine mis-wicking a 6" and having to remelt? I can drop a 4" back in the pour pot, but I'd need to break up the 6", or go use a large saucepan and the dutch oven.

But I figure if an FO requires more that 4-5% load to get a decent throw then it isn't worth it's price.

I'm with you there. Even with containers or soy, I just can't on principle want to work with something that needs more than 4-5%. No idea how much that specialty website that claims their tealights scent up a room use, but I'm not even trying to make anything that strong. I like some scent to a candle, but if I need to "knock my socks off" (CS's language) then I'll just burn some incense or use some other cold (maybe forced air) diffuser, or one of the many devices either electric or candle powered that heat a small dish of scent oil.

But, here's hoping the polyboost is another option for making stuff like this: