FO throw question ::bangs head::

[artcwolf]

Okay so i've learned a lot from you all

I was using to much vybar, was using 1 teaspoon per pound of wax, and not weighing my scent instead i was measuing with a shot glass (now weighting at 1oz per lb). So with what i learned i broke out a new batch of candles last night (learned to start small once it works then make more after last night 6lbs not smelling like i want) and after spending a few hours making votives and a couple of containers i'm still not getting the throw i was getting before i started using the vybar.

I'm using IGI 1343 - 138mp All Purpose Paraffin from C&S and their scents as well.

So the question is can i use less vybar to get more throw and still retain the smooth finish? I'm thinking 1/2 teaspoon per 2 lbs of wax, and maybe increasing the scent a bit to about 3oz per pound?

[grama]

This is what CS says about 1343 - I use 4786 and use 1/2 tsp vybar 260 and very seldom go over 1 oz pp. I have learned more fo does not mean a stronger smelling candle.

Specifications:

Wax Type:ParaffinAppearance:Translucent, RusticMax Fragrance:3% or 1/2oz./lb.Applications:- Chunk Candles

- Bear Dipping

- Pillars

- Votives

- Tarts

Pour temp:185° (+/-5°)Melt Point:138°Oil Content:.25

[artcwolf]

Thanks Grama, I've also got some 1286 because it does state containers and votives and pillars, but i just havent got around to using it yet, because i want ot use up the other first. Here's the specs on the 1286, I do use the vybar 103, which is what CS suggested for the 1343

This is a great versatile wax and useful for tealights, votives, containers, tarts, pillars and refill candles. Without addtives, it produces a mottled candle with a nice shiny finish. A smooth creamy candle can be acheived by adding 1 tsp. of Vybar 103 or 1/4 oz. Microsere per lb.

Type: Paraffin

Meltpoint: 130 degrees

Primary Use: tealights, containers, votives, tarts, electric candles, pillars, grubby candles, pies etc.

Wick Suggestion: compatible with any wick

Recommended Pouring Temperature: 180-190 degrees

Instructions for Use: Melt wax to 180 degrees, add color and scent and additives if desired. Pouring cooler at 160 degrees or below will produce a nice mottle and pouring warmer will give a more sporatic mottled appearance.

I'll give the 1286 a try tonight and see what happens....I'll keep you posted

[grama]

OK - Sorry, forgot to add the 4786 is the container wax I use. I use 4625 for my pillars. I have found that adding about 1/8 lb of soy per lb of wax, & 1/2 tsp vybar 103 to this and heating to around 210 for 10-15 minutes has so far, knock on wood:p , kept the fingernailing I had in the past away. Just hope it keeps on working for I have a large 3wick pillar to pour.

Just recently got some 1343A to try for rustics but was not satisfied with first try. Might have added to much steric. When I get time, hopefully next week, gonna try it with less steric.

Good luck with yours.

[Pam W]

maybe increasing the scent a bit to about 3oz per pound?

3 oz pp - absolutely not - that's a 19% FO load

[artcwolf]

oops this is why i need to read my posts before i submit them...that was suppose to be 2oz pp, or about 1.5oz pp.

I'm going to make a couple of 1 pound runs making votives and try less vybar and see what happens. Just need to kick the wife out of the kitchen first:laugh2:

[artcwolf]

Okay i'm able to use 1/4 teaspoon of vybar pp and it looks great, the throw is stronger then the 1/2 teaspoon, but still not as strong as before for the vybar. Going to try less vybar tommorrow and see what happens. Going to burn the tests from last night tomorrow while making the next test batch

[Pam W]

How 'bout telling us what fragrance(s) & type/size of wicks you are working with?

[artcwolf]

For wicks i'm using primed 2/0 and 4/0 square braide, and primed 36 ply flat braid for pillars and containers, and Heinz Pretabbed 2 1/2" CD-4 for votives from Candle and Supplies. I called and asked what they thought would be the better wicks to use, and went with that they suggested.

Scents that i've used so far are root beer(no vybar smells absolutly wonderful) Vermont Maple, Cranberry chutney, peppermint, pumpkin spice, last night i did my test batches with ginger lime. All are from candle and supplies.

With the pumkin spice i made a batch with no vybar, had left overs and re-melted it down and added vybar per the weight of the left over, and according to my guinea pig at the office the no vybar batch had more scent then the vybar batch. She likes the cold throw, but the hot throw is mild and like my wickless below you had to stand on top of them to smell them from the vybar batches. She's also tested my vermont maple, and peppermint with the same results as the vybar pumpkin spice.

I made a wickless cranberry chutney and peppermint and put both of them on my warming plate just for throw testing and i had to be on top of them to smell them. However while making them they smelled wonderful, the peppermint will clean out the sinuses

I'm going to test the warm throw from my testing batches made last night tommorrow after they have another day to cure.

I still haven't tried the 1286 as i want to use up the 1343 first.

Sorry for the lack of information, it wasn't until the last 3 or 4 batches that i started taking notes...I'm slow that way, took me making several different rubs and such for my grill and not being able to recreate them before i started taking notes for them as well...:undecided I can take some pictures of the candles before vybar and after vybar if that'll help as well....

[Pam W]

Sorry for the lack of information, it wasn't until the last 3 or 4 batches that i started taking notes...I'm slow that way, took me making several different rubs and such for my grill and not being able to recreate them before i started taking notes for them as well...:undecided I can take some pictures of the candles before vybar and after vybar if that'll help as well....

When your new, it's hard to know ''what you don't know" I rarely use vybar because I make mostly rustics & mottles and since vybar kills the mottle, I use stearic or polyboost.

On the wicks, the 36ply is pretty big - I use 24 & 27 ply in 1343- 3" pillars. I do use 30 & 36 in some candles that I make exclusively for myself with some heavy earthy scents. Sometimes, a larger wick can burn off your FO quickly and leave nothing for scenting the room - if that makes sense. What size of pillars are you putting the 36ply in?

I made some pillars with Dragon's Blood, testing scents from two different suppliers and was getting almost no hot throw at all then yesterday I decided to try one more time but with a different wick...surprise, surprise - it worked.

Unfortunately there are no clear answers in candlemaking - it always comes back to testing and since you are testing your little heart out, I'd say you are on the right track. Working with too many scents and applications at one time can become overwhelming. I'd recommend you concentrate on either pillars or containers, work with one till you're comfortable then move on to the other.

And we always like to see pics:D

[artcwolf]

The 36 wick is for my 4 inch square pillare molds, and my mason and bulb jars that are 4 inches in size. I've been using the 4/0 for my 3x6 pillars and the 2/0 for my 2x6 pillars. I found out today that both wax types support 1.5oz FO pp and 1/4 vybar will take out the molting of the wax. Yeah i called C&S for the FO retention of the wax

I'll take some pictures today and share them with you.

[ChrisR]

Probably the oils you are using are the reason you aren't getting a good throw. I tired Candles and Supplies many moons ago, but found their FO's very weak 9 out of 10 times in my waxes.

[artcwolf]

okay here's a couple of pictures ofr the pumpkin spice, top is with vybar, bottom is without. Sorry it's a bit blurry

[Maggie]

I have to agree with ChrisR. I DO like C&S for some things but not their fragrance oils. I too tried them way back and didn't have luck when I used paraffin. I would try samples from other suppliers.

Maggie

[artcwolf]

That's a bummer on the scents as i've got a bunch of it Thankfully it's a lot of 4 oz bottles.

Other then CS and C&S what's a good place for scents?

[Pam W]

Go to the Fragrance section and start reading --search that forum for the scents you're interested in and don't miss the thread on Bert's Heavens Scents - I've been happy with everything I've tried from Bert. But there's lots of suppliers out there and we all have our favorites - I use FOs from 6 different suppliers!! Bert and Peaks both have a good pumpkin

[artcwolf]

Okay so an update. I've taken some more candles into my tester including one of my 4x6 pillers of the candles that i've used vybar in, and after 2 hours the 4x6 had a nice smell to the room wasn't over powering, but it smelled wonderful.

She tested a few more of the votives this time in a smaller room, and the throw was better then when she first tested a few of the others. both of the testers votives (with and Without vybar) gave out to her the same throw, the amount of scent from the candle must mach the size of the room

Her deduction to my not getting the throw i want is candlenose

[debscent]

You poured some strong scents, you probably do have candle nose (the peppermint can mess up your nose for a few days). I started with C&S and quickly found out their are better FOs out there. I used Candle Science, Candle Source, Backwoods, Wildfire, Peaks and Daystar and recently Tennessee.