Supplier Rant - Just Scent

[NattyCat]

OK. I love JS oils. I've tried so many I've lost count. Some are duff, some are good, some are simply outstanding as you would expect with all suppliers.

So, after testing testing testing. I decide to add an oil to my range. I go to order and it's been discontinued. I simply can't COUNT the number of times I've gone to the JS site to reorder an oil that I stock and yep, you guessed it - DISCONTINUED.

OK so I know she wants to bring in new stock and get rid of stock that doesn't sell so well, but I'm now seriously deciding if I can afford to have JS oils in my range with the amount of time I'm wasting testing only to find the oil is discontinued, or trying to placate my customer who LOVES a particular fragrance and I've told her she can't have it any more.

So I have casablanca, look out point, sandalwood and bee blossom, etc etc etc etc in my range and now they've disappeared from the JS site. So i emailed JS twice, to two different addresses, asking if she had ANY left of casablanca, even if it was a pound or two - and if not, can she tell me where to get it. No reply. I can't see why not. If she doesn't want to sell it she could at least tell us buyers where we CAN get it from so we don't have to rearrange our whole product range and disappoint our customers.

I really liked these oils, and ok - it's not the end of the world, I can replace them. But if I choose another set of oils from JS...who's to say they won't be discontinued in 6 months and i'll be back at square one. I need a long term, solid, reliable supplier who doesn't change their product line-up on a frequent basis. Is that so much to ask?

[BLSoaps]

Hi Natty,

Sorry about your frustrations with JS. I'm hoping this info might help. It'll depend on what kind of quantities you're able to purchase at once you decide on scents, I'm sure.

I agree that they should have returned your email regardless. Not returning an e-mail is just rude. Even if they don't have any. Since they're surely purchasing directly from the manufacturer, I highly doubt they're going to let you know who, what, or any other details. It's like a customer at a show asking where you buy your stuff. You don't want to reveal your sources, and they don't want to reveal theirs.

For these current FOs from them that you'd like to offer, but they've discontinued, you may want to ask if they can order it in FOR you. You'd have much higher minimums, but it might be a possibility. I know it's often 25 lbs or even 25 kgs minimums per scent. They may not do it, but you'll never know unless you ask. (assuming they ever answer your emails)

Also, a note on this. One supplier may have 10 different versions of one scent. They may have also tweaked it slightly just for JS (higher flash point, better for candles, B&B safe, etc) No one else may even carry this exact scent. So asking who else carries it, even if they bought the basic formula, they probably wouldn't know who else carried it. Their manufacturer isn't going to give out that information either. FOs are a very proprietary business.

Alternative Two - order directly from the manufacturer. They usually are more than willing to send out small samples (I got 50 gram ones when I was testing Flavor Oils) for you to test. Then after you test them in your products, you order their minimums (again, we're back to those 25 lbs or 25 kgs amounts most likely). You could sell off extra or simply hoard it.

I hope something in here helps.

[Carrie]

You might try asking on the classifieds if anyone has any of those scents. If you get them, then you could discontinue the scent and give clients the option to buy more.

I think I have some JS Sandalwood, if I can find it, you pay the shipping and it's yours.

[NattyCat]

Hi all

thanks for the responses. it's hard getting any US manufacturer to work with you when you're overseas tho!

I'll have a look at what I'm running low on and see if anyone has them in classies. the point i was making though is that I don't really want to keep discontinuing oils that are good, just because JS rotate their stock faster than lightening.

[BLSoaps]

Natty, sorry you're having such difficulty in working with suppliers. I've got several wonderful international customers, and I just love working with them. It's a shame more businesses aren't willing to work with our international soapers and chandlers. I don't know if there's anything I can do to possibly help, but if there is, PM or e-mail me. I've reshipped some items to some of my international customers when companies they wanted to order from didn't offer any kind of reasonable international shipping options (or even any at all).

I also wanted to add a note, thanks to several inquiries I received through PMs. Yes, there are many manufacturers that will give out samplers to those who inquiry. These are for TESTING PURPOSES. If you don't intend to actually purchase from them, please don't request these samples. In my opinion, it's dishonest and unethical to request free samples such as these, unless you are truly planning on ordering these products from them (in their bulk minimums) in the future. I know if these companies ever stop sending out these testing samples, a lot of FO suppliers probably wouldn't bring in nearly as many new scents. Would you want to invest blindly in a drum of FO that you've never smelled and never tested in any kind of product? No. THAT is what these testers are for. Not someone just looking for a freebie.

If I've upset anyone, I apologize. I know I relied heavily on those samples when I got them, and I'll be relying on them heavily again, as we're planning on bringing in some more after Christmas. And I'm very much small time compared to the big FO companies, like Just Scent. To those who PMd me asking where I got these samples, if simply getting a freebie was not your intent, then please know this wasn't directed at you in that way. I still don't share my suppliers though. If you were looking for a freebie, well.... yeah.... You know my opinion.

[Becky Jo]

Natty Cat - I have not received emails from you regarding discontinued oils or I would have responded to you, so please accept my apology. The oils you are speaking of were on the Discontinued list for several months, with quantities available listed. We also made several announcements when I further lowered the discontinued prices.

Rather than compromise the oils by keeping them or buy more, at a higher price due to purchasing in smaller volume, for an oil that doesn't sell well, I decided to discontinue them.

Casablanca was an oil that was brought out last year for Valentine's Day - we had it listed on our Fragrance List since mid to late January or earlier. It was not selling well, so we decided to discontinue it this summer. We had notices almost daily when I added it to to the discontinued list as to how many pounds we had left in stock. At any time, when looking at the discontinued oils, I listed how many pounds were and are available; all oils listed except Tahitian Tiare have how many pounds are available.

Lookout Point is an oil I have stocked since 2004 and you can still find it on the Discontinued Oil Page - when it is sold out I will no longer stock it. It has been discontinued by the Manufacturer. Sandalwood and Bee Blossom was an oil I held onto for a long time. It was on my fragrance list for well over a year. Personally, I love that oil, but it was not a big seller for us. Again, I added it to the discontinued list this past summer. I listed how many pounds were left and updated it as it sold. It was on the discontinued list for several months until it too sold out.

As with most oils, I generally try to stock them for at least 6-8 months, if they are not selling well at at that point, I will discontinue them or put them on sale to see if that will generate some sales. If they still do not sell well, after being put on sale, I will discontinue them. I do not feel that is lightening fast. I feel they have been given ample amount of time to be tested and ordered.

JS is no different than anyone else as far as keeping and buying items that do not sell well. I cannot afford to re-stock oils that I had to sell below cost to move. I like to try different things to see if they work or not. I can at least say we tried.

Just Scent has many, many oils listed that have been on our fragrance list for a long time. In the three years we have been open, the list of discontinued oils has been slim compared to the list of oils we add and keep. I have not added any oils to the discontinued list since early summer.

Natty, I am not sure sure who you are placing orders with, but I have not received an order from you, in your name, since February. I looked thru everything and cannnot find anything except the February order. None of the oils you discussed were on that order.

I am very sorry you are disappointed; I would like to extend my apologies for your inconvenience and again for the email mishap. I assure you I would have gladly responded had I received them. Since you have been unable to reach me thru the Just Scent email - please feel free to use my personal email account - beckyjo@roadrunner.com

I can order Casablanca and Sandalwood and Bee Blossom in 10 pound increments as a Special Order for you.

[sharyl55]

Natty, sorry you are having problems. It is highly unusual for JS no to respond to an e-mail. I have gotten responses late on a Sat. night. Have you tried going to the web site and using contact us to send them an e-mail?

Each supplier has to make a business decision on the volume of orders needed to maintain inv. on an item. As a business man yourself I'm sure you understand that. I's sure that Becky will place a special order for you on a discontinued FO. She has for me. I needed to order the min. qty. For my favorite FO it was 10 lbs.

Try contacting them again. I'm sure they will work something out for you.

[NattyCat]

Natty Cat - I have not received emails from you regarding discontinued oils or I would have responded to you, so please accept my apology. The oils you are speaking of were on the Discontinued list for several months, with quantities available listed. We also made several announcements when I further lowered the discontinued prices.

Rather than compromise the oils by keeping them or buy more, at a higher price due to purchasing in smaller volume, for an oil that doesn't sell well, I decided to discontinue them.

Casablanca was an oil that was brought out last year for Valentine's Day - we had it listed on our Fragrance List since mid to late January or earlier. It was not selling well, so we decided to discontinue it this summer. We had notices almost daily when I added it to to the discontinued list as to how many pounds we had left in stock. At any time, when looking at the discontinued oils, I listed how many pounds were and are available; all oils listed except Tahitian Tiare have how many pounds are available.

Lookout Point is an oil I have stocked since 2004 and you can still find it on the Discontinued Oil Page - when it is sold out I will no longer stock it. It has been discontinued by the Manufacturer. Sandalwood and Bee Blossom was an oil I held onto for a long time. It was on my fragrance list for well over a year. Personally, I love that oil, but it was not a big seller for us. Again, I added it to the discontinued list this past summer. I listed how many pounds were left and updated it as it sold. It was on the discontinued list for several months until it too sold out.

As with most oils, I generally try to stock them for at least 6-8 months, if they are not selling well at at that point, I will discontinue them or put them on sale to see if that will generate some sales. If they still do not sell well, after being put on sale, I will discontinue them. I do not feel that is lightening fast. I feel they have been given ample amount of time to be tested and ordered.

JS is no different than anyone else as far as keeping and buying items that do not sell well. I cannot afford to re-stock oils that I had to sell below cost to move. I like to try different things to see if they work or not. I can at least say we tried.

Just Scent has many, many oils listed that have been on our fragrance list for a long time. In the three years we have been open, the list of discontinued oils has been slim compared to the list of oils we add and keep. I have not added any oils to the discontinued list since early summer.

Natty, I am not sure sure who you are placing orders with, but I have not received an order from you, in your name, since February. I looked thru everything and cannnot find anything except the February order. None of the oils you discussed were on that order.

I am very sorry you are disappointed; I would like to extend my apologies for your inconvenience and again for the email mishap. I assure you I would have gladly responded had I received them. Since you have been unable to reach me thru the Just Scent email - please feel free to use my personal email account - beckyjo@roadrunner.com

I can order Casablanca and Sandalwood and Bee Blossom in 10 pound increments as a Special Order for you.

Hi Becky,

I had a feeling I may get a reply here which is why I posted. I did email twice as I said but obviously it didn't get through.

You are right, I don't order in MY name any more. I having "buying sprees" in the US via a friend of mine. They order, collect and hang on to my items for a while until a sufficient stock has been gathered together to be sent over to the UK in one big package because the postage is cheaper.

Therefore, with any oil I order I have at least one months delay before I get my hands on it, then I have to find the time to test and also offer it to my customers and monitor its popularity for a few months.

When I test and offer it up for sale, it is only then I can figure if it's a good seller. As you said, if you make a decision after 6 months to discontinue, then I am the same - my turnaround to decide if an oil is to be added to my list is usually 6 months or longer - so if an oil I had first discovered made its way on to your discontinued list shortly after I found it, then by the time I have the testing and sales figures in and want to reorder - the oil is then gone.

Whilst I completely understand that you need to keep your sales figure high and drop non-sellers, I just get frustrated at oils disappearing on me. It is HARD here in the UK to get good oils - the time & cost to get them here is ridiculous and we pay double, sometimes triple for the oils than our American counterparts when you factor in the shipping costs. I hope, therefore, that you can understand that if I find a keeper - I want to be able to order for a couple of years at least!

Please don't feel that it's just you. I also need Amber Seduction from Candle Science and that's gone too.

[NattyCat]

Natty, sorry you are having problems. It is highly unusual for JS no to respond to an e-mail. I have gotten responses late on a Sat. night. Have you tried going to the web site and using contact us to send them an e-mail?

Each supplier has to make a business decision on the volume of orders needed to maintain inv. on an item. As a business man yourself I'm sure you understand that. I's sure that Becky will place a special order for you on a discontinued FO. She has for me. I needed to order the min. qty. For my favorite FO it was 10 lbs.

Try contacting them again. I'm sure they will work something out for you.

Thanks, I got my reply now. oh and i'm a woman.

[sharyl55]

Sorry about that. Then as a business woman, I'm sure you understand. Since you have such a long lag time between ordering and receiving US supplies, you may want to talk to Becky about ordering the min. qty on the discontinued items. Like I said she did that for me.

[hollies]

Hi, Natty!

Have you tried using The Candle Source? They have a supply of Sandalwood scents. I don't know about your other scents, but I've been using them for a while and they are wonderful! Awesome customer service and they ship immediately!

Good luck!!

[Blest2BAmerican]

Have you tried www.peakcandle.com and www.bittercreek.com for your oils? Both outstanding companies to get supplies from and they don't seem change their oils so frequently.

[candleaddict]

I second Peak and Bittercreek. I've heard great things about JS and have been building a list of scents to try, but now that I know she considers 1 year a long time to carry a scent, I'd be in the same boat as you, Natty. Thanks for the post.