schmoopie Posted September 12, 2006 Share Posted September 12, 2006 Ok, I decided to check out the whole wickless thing:DMaybe just add one size of wickless to my line........ I've seen them at my sons school and in offices and though none of my whole accounts have asked if I carry them, I want to be prepared.........So, I go get a warmer from wallyworld yesterday to test a wickless I had made on....(using a 10 oz elavation glass and my normal para-soy container blend) and after alittle while, as the wax was melting from the bottom up, it squirted out of the container.....hit my walls and spurted up high enough to get the bottom of the cabinet it was sitting under.....What the heck!! I know if I poked some relief holes it would probably solve this problem, but the last thing I want to say to the consumer or retailer.....is "hey if you don't poke some holes in this baby, you may have a mess on your hands!"They'll be flying off the shelves....lol.The container is pretty short and shallow..........Any ideas from wickless chandlers??TIAVolcano Grrllllllll Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candle Man Posted September 12, 2006 Share Posted September 12, 2006 That is why I don't like candle warmers.They only heat from the bottom, some waxes take hours to completely melt before you have any scent throw. Then you have the problem with the heat only from the bottom, the top is still solid and when the melted wax finally heats throught the top, wax squirts out leaving a mess everywhere.I Only Sell electric potpourri pots and use wax melts in them. I do not sell wickless candle jars. I use an Aroma Housewares Co. brand that heats not only the bottom but all the way up the sides. Others out there heat only from the bottom just like a candle warmer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schmoopie Posted September 12, 2006 Author Share Posted September 12, 2006 BUT unforunately, you can not control what kind of warmer someone who buys a wickless candle will be using......... so you have to test for all situations. This warmer did not take forever to heat the candle, as I said this is a pretty flat, short jar.......... It just squirted......then it was all liquid in a short time and really scented the whole downstairs of my home quickly.I sell 3 sizes of tins, so I'm thinking of testing the 8 oz. also, no glass to worry about breaking, yadda, yadda....Although I much prefer a buring candle, as a retailer I don't want to overlook this niche in the market.......just don't want volcanos:DAND don't want to have to tell the consumer what kind of melter they should be using, cuz we all know they are going to do what they want regardless....I would think those of you out there that sell the wickless mason jars (I've seen alot) would have the same problem............ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lsbennis Posted September 12, 2006 Share Posted September 12, 2006 hmmm....I never heard of that before...I was thinking of doing wickless as I have found a supplier for the warmers and I have been putting 10oz bulb jars on them every day without problems. Does this happen often? :embarasse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jane42 Posted September 12, 2006 Share Posted September 12, 2006 Well, this scares the heck out of me! I have never had one do that to me. Our jars do not fit on the cup holder style heaters that I have, so I have only used the cachepot warmers for testing. Has anyone else had this problem.....or any "weird" problems with the wickless and what they are melted on? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schmoopie Posted September 12, 2006 Author Share Posted September 12, 2006 This is the first time I ever put a wickless candle on a burner.......so I don't know if it happens often....lol. Like I said this is a flat, short jar with a pretty wide mouth.......ok now,I have to go put it on the warmer again...... I'll post again i awhile.......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bizzyb Posted September 12, 2006 Share Posted September 12, 2006 I am new on here and do not post alot but I have expericence with this one. I have had that happen, try not filling your container as full. You may have had an air bubble in the wax that caused it to be so "eruptive". I make relief holes as my candles are curing to release any air. If you make your relief holes before they are completly cured while the tops are still liquid your tops will still be smooth.HTH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jane42 Posted September 12, 2006 Share Posted September 12, 2006 I am using 4630/1945, which does not require a second pour. Now I am wondering if I should do relief holes and second pours, just to be sure......Thanks for the advice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candle Man Posted September 12, 2006 Share Posted September 12, 2006 Relief holes would have nothing to do with this problem.What happens is the wax melts from the bottom up. The melted wax under the still solid top is warm and heat causes pressure. Then when the wax melts through the top the pressure causes it to spew. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schmoopie Posted September 12, 2006 Author Share Posted September 12, 2006 Exactly Candleman..... and I put it on the burner and it did it again. It's not like this huge explosive amount of wax........just alittle spew/squirt....enough that I wouldn't want to clean it up everytime. I think I will try the tins.... I don't know of many containers out there with a wider mouth than this one. And I have to test like the consumer and use the wallyworld warmer..... sooo surprised more people aren't having this happen.......definately not an air bubble. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jane42 Posted September 12, 2006 Share Posted September 12, 2006 Ahhh, Candle Man, that makes sense. I wonder if I should put on my tags that the (jar) wickless candles should only be used with the cachpot or crock warmers....one more thing to think about....LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schmoopie Posted September 12, 2006 Author Share Posted September 12, 2006 So are any tin users out there having this happen??And Jane, I think you could put that on the tag, but people are still going to get the cheap melters from wally world and Michaels and use them anyway!I 've got mine on the melter still (post spew) and I really don't think it's any better than a tart......May scrap the idea altogether........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jane42 Posted September 12, 2006 Share Posted September 12, 2006 And Jane, I think you could put that on the tag, but people are still going to get the cheap melters from wally world and Michaels and use them anyway!I 've got mine on the melter still (post spew) and I really don't think it's any better than a tart......May scrap the idea altogether........As far as I know, my jars won't fit on those BUT I know alot of people that use those for their jars - even the large ones! I know alot of people sell the wickless successfully, so I am hoping some of them will get on here and give us their advice.The only reason I would put that on my tag is so that if it does "spew" all over while being used on a plate warmer, they would know it wasn't recommended to be used that way....but we all know how much that would help me down the road. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jecwittm Posted September 12, 2006 Share Posted September 12, 2006 Someone else on another thread here suggested using the Ball Elite Mason jars (you can get these at Wally World). They’re a wide mouth 8 oz jar, the mouth is 3” in diameter, the base is about 3 ¼”, the body of the jar is approx. 3 ½’ across and 1” tall (entire jar minus lid is 1 ¾” tall) and is squared with rounded corners. Do you think using a low MP container blend or straight soy in a jar such as this would alleviate the problem? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jane42 Posted September 12, 2006 Share Posted September 12, 2006 Someone else on another thread here suggested using the Ball Elite Mason jars (you can get these at Wally World). They’re a wide mouth 8 oz jar, the mouth is 3” in diameter, the base is about 3 ¼”, the body of the jar is approx. 3 ½’ across and 1” tall (entire jar minus lid is 1 ¾” tall) and is squared with rounded corners. Do you think using a low MP container blend or straight soy in a jar such as this would alleviate the problem?I did use the Ball Elite mason jar with the plate warmer while testing 464 soy and did not have any problems. It melted in a reasonable amount of time and looked quite cute! I love those jars! I have not tried them with paraffin. I have not had any problems, so far, with wickless 10 oz with paraffin jars or the elite 8 oz with soy, so I have no clue as to why one would "spew" and another wouldn't..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jecwittm Posted September 12, 2006 Share Posted September 12, 2006 I did use the Ball Elite mason jar with the plate warmer while testing 464 soy and did not have any problems. It melted in a reasonable amount of time and looked quite cute! I love those jars! .....I'm so glad to hear that, Jane! If the truth be know, I've accumulated quite a sizeable personal stash of these. Every time I go to WallyWorld for cat food (which is quite often), I pick up a 4-pack of these. I guess it's high time I think about pouring something now! LOL! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Georgia Posted September 12, 2006 Share Posted September 12, 2006 You need to use a shallow jar (wide mouth is good) and don't fill it all the way....give room for expansion. The taller the jar, the more you will have the issue of the bottom warming too fast with no where to go but up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngelaVA Posted September 12, 2006 Share Posted September 12, 2006 I've used the Ball Elite jars and 8oz tins and I've never had a problem (fingers crossed and knocking on wood here) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadyBugCandles Posted September 13, 2006 Share Posted September 13, 2006 I use the Ball Elite jars and a 70/30 blend and haven't had any issues yet either. These melt pretty evenly and not sraight up the middle, I've also tested several different warmers too. HTH! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiamondCreek Candles Posted September 13, 2006 Share Posted September 13, 2006 You know! My guess is that this particular wax had air trapped in the jar when the wax started to cure. As it heated up it sure did relieve itself! I wanted to post to your thread because if you take a look at our brand of wickless candles you can see by the pictures on our website they are much different than typical wax. They are made of 100% SOY and start to melt and SMELL ASAP. These are really really good I swear to you. We are located in Las Vegas and all candles are made daily. I do not want to be in trouble for giving out a link so if you want to see them you will have to do a search for DiamondCreek Candles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tallbabydoll Posted September 13, 2006 Share Posted September 13, 2006 I dont make these or container candles so I cant speak of experience, but I would think that tins would be the best idea for these. I would think that the tin itself would heat up therefore melting the sides as well as the bottom, no seal to blow.Diamondcreek I looked at your site out of curiosity, and yours are different than any others I've seen. I thought 100% soy is 100% soy how can that be different. It's the fact that it looks like you either bought "soy beads" or made your own and filled up jars with them. If you made your own, would you mind sharing how you made them? THis has been a topic of threads many times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schmoopie Posted September 13, 2006 Author Share Posted September 13, 2006 You need to use a shallow jar (wide mouth is good) and don't fill it all the way....give room for expansion. The taller the jar, the more you will have the issue of the bottom warming too fast with no where to go but up.I did use a shallow jar. It is only 2 inches tall and about the same across the top. Don't see how the 8 oz. mason jars don't blow.I am on to tins!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mammapajama Posted September 13, 2006 Share Posted September 13, 2006 Hey Jane42, I also use 4630 and recently discovered that I have holes developing. Nothing has been noticeable on the surface, but I was cleaning up some tops with my heat gun and found a nice little hole open up in the center. Doing everything according to proper instructions and can't figure it out, so I have been poking relief holes in EVERYTHING just to be safe. I have noticed that when the holes open up there can be a tiny bit of a splash from the wax. Nothing so far that has gone beyond the perameters of the container. It is really making me crazy since I thought I had this wax figured out! Anyway, I have been working on wickless also and this really put a dent into my plan. HTH. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jane42 Posted September 13, 2006 Share Posted September 13, 2006 Hey Jane42, I also use 4630 and recently discovered that I have holes developing. Nothing has been noticeable on the surface, but I was cleaning up some tops with my heat gun and found a nice little hole open up in the center. Doing everything according to proper instructions and can't figure it out, so I have been poking relief holes in EVERYTHING just to be safe. I have noticed that when the holes open up there can be a tiny bit of a splash from the wax. Nothing so far that has gone beyond the perameters of the container. It is really making me crazy since I thought I had this wax figured out! Anyway, I have been working on wickless also and this really put a dent into my plan. HTH.Oh, that is just beautiful!!! NOT! I have been working on the wicked candles with this wax, refusing to sell them until I feel they are where we want them to be "burn-wise", but I have sold a few of the wickless. Now I find out they can't be TRUSTED to behave either!!!! LOL4630 is suppose to be a one-pour, which is why we have worked so hard and so long to get it wicked right. If I have to do relief holes and do second pours, it defeats the whole purpose of using it.......aaagggrrrhhhh, this is so frustrating! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Everito Bandito Posted September 13, 2006 Share Posted September 13, 2006 Here is a similar thread:http://www.candletech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8143&highlight=explode Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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