Regina Filange Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 How do I get my pillars to stop bulging around the melt pool? I want them to curve inward at the top, but not bulge below that. My wick and melt pool are fine and I don't get blow outs, but they bulge terribley!Does adding vybar or UA help with this? If so... what can I do to stop a mottled candle from bulging? I've added vybar (the one safe for mottles, can't think of the number at the moment) but doesn't seem to help with bulging.Any help?TIA~RF~ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LRC06301983 Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 first question anyone is going to ask is...what type of was are you using?Is it a suitable pillar wax? Have you tried adding any stearic acid to make the candle stronger? that will also lower the MP which might help the walls melt inwards a little quicker.additionally you might still have a wick that is too large or small. Too small and it isn't melting the walls before it tunnels down and makes the candle bulge... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regina Filange Posted February 3, 2006 Author Share Posted February 3, 2006 Oh ya....My mottling wax is 1274 which is why I don't add stearic. It will ruin the mottle effect.I also have Peak 140 straight parafin, which is suppose to be a mottle wax, but doesn't mottle well which is why they don't offer it anymore. I've been using that for regular and rustic candles. I do add stearic to that, but still no luck. Perhaps I'm not using enough?I "think" my wick is fine. My melt pool looks perfect IMO, but I'm also new at making pillars. I make a great container though! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scented Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 Steric won't ruin your mottle. Try adding by T and you'll see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geekrunner Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 Top may want to chime in, but I seem to think that some UA will raise the MP enough to keep it from softening up around the MP and bulging.geek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dustpuuppy Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 Top may want to chime in, but I seem to think that some UA will raise the MP enough to keep it from softening up around the MP and bulging.geekI'm not sure, but I was under the impression that UA would kill the mottle, just like vybar does ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topofmurrayhill Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 IGI 1274 and IGI 1343 aren't well suited for high quality mottled candles. In fact I would call them downright crappy for that application, though they are excellent when used with additives for other types of candles.As far as paraffins that are specifically sold as mottling blends, Candlewic 4045H is the only good one I know of. Of course there are other usable paraffins that will mottle.A few people have experimented with small amounts of other hardeners to improve the burning qualities of 1274/1343 mottles. Something like 0.5% Fischer-Tropsch wax (Clear Crystals or Translucent Crystals) might help, but I don't much care for the aesthetic results and it's a lot more trouble than just using the right wax. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beth-VT Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 Gotta agree with the 4045H, and with the stearic. I've been using stearic and some V-343 in my 4045H and it's working great. I've just burned my first 3-wick (6" dia) as well as a 3" pillar in the same scent all the way down, some burns were as long as 12 hours, and I haven't hugged either of them once. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SatinDucky Posted February 4, 2006 Share Posted February 4, 2006 A good experiment done by e on this...http://www.candletech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2360&highlight=mottle+bulge+stearicThere are a few other threads that might help too if you search it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fern Posted February 4, 2006 Share Posted February 4, 2006 I use 4045...not the "H" with 1 teaspoon pp vybar 343 and 1 tablespoon stearic pp and it retains it shape very well...even after long burns. Once hugged during the first burn...it continues to consume itself without any additional hugging. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Margaritamama Posted February 4, 2006 Share Posted February 4, 2006 I use 4045...not the "H" with 1 teaspoon pp vybar 343 and 1 tablespoon stearic pp and it retains it shape very well...even after long burns. Once hugged during the first burn...it continues to consume itself without any additional hugging.Fern, where do you buy your vybar 343??? I've been looking to buy some for my 1343, but have struggled to find it..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topofmurrayhill Posted February 4, 2006 Share Posted February 4, 2006 Fern, where do you buy your vybar 343??? I've been looking to buy some for my 1343, but have struggled to find it.....Candlewic sells it. If you order from there you could also get the 4045H wax. It will do worlds more for your mottles than Vybar 343. In fact the 343 could conceivably make the bulge worse because it has a very low melting point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fern Posted February 4, 2006 Share Posted February 4, 2006 Yes...I get the Vybar 343 from Candlewic. Top: I have not experienced the bulging with the 4045 with the Vybar 343/Stearic. I don't know how different the 4045 is from the 4045H but I've have had excellent results with that combo of additives. I understand that Candlewic no longer carries the 4045 so when I need more wax I'll be looking at the 4045H and will be sure to take note of the additives that people are using with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topofmurrayhill Posted February 4, 2006 Share Posted February 4, 2006 Yes...I get the Vybar 343 from Candlewic. Top: I have not experienced the bulging with the 4045 with the Vybar 343/Stearic. I don't know how different the 4045 is from the 4045H but I've have had excellent results with that combo of additives. I understand that Candlewic no longer carries the 4045 so when I need more wax I'll be looking at the 4045H and will be sure to take note of the additives that people are using with it.Hi Fern, you won't have a problem with the 4045H. It's not so much a matter of the additives. The 4045 and 4045H both have a suitable melting point and hardness for making highly fragranced mottles with a balanced burn. You'll just have to fiddle around a bit because they mottle differently, but that's basically an aesthetic issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Margaritamama Posted February 4, 2006 Share Posted February 4, 2006 Candlewic sells it. If you order from there you could also get the 4045H wax. It will do worlds more for your mottles than Vybar 343. In fact the 343 could conceivably make the bulge worse because it has a very low melting point.Yeah, I wish I'd known that before I ordered 2 CASES of 1343!!!!! I figured seeing as how 1343 is a straight paraffin, it would be the easiest to work with using additives?!?! Shows how wrong I was........ Oh well, here goes many - and I mean many - more crappy mottles........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topofmurrayhill Posted February 4, 2006 Share Posted February 4, 2006 Yeah, I wish I'd known that before I ordered 2 CASES of 1343!!!!! I figured seeing as how 1343 is a straight paraffin, it would be the easiest to work with using additives?!?! Shows how wrong I was........ Oh well, here goes many - and I mean many - more crappy mottles........That's totally true EXCEPT you can't use most additives for a mottle and you can't even use much stearic. I'm not even sure the stearic helps because it lowers the melting point even more. 343 sure won't help.What happens with these candles is that you don't get a balanced burn. The bulge is caused by melted wax pooling faster than it can be used up. That softens the sides until they bulge, and if you burn the candle long enough it could blow out as well.The normal solution to get it into balance is a larger wick but you can't really use one large enough. One slim hope if you have to deal with it is to find a wick that likes to burn more downwards and sucks up a lot of wax. Maybe square braid? Haven't tried it and don't know if it would help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Margaritamama Posted February 4, 2006 Share Posted February 4, 2006 Thanks Top!Is there anything else I can use that will raise the melt point on the 1343? Gloss poly, or universal additive help any??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topofmurrayhill Posted February 4, 2006 Share Posted February 4, 2006 Thanks Top!Is there anything else I can use that will raise the melt point on the 1343? Gloss poly, or universal additive help any???Not for mottles.Using additives and 1343 as a base wax, you can make all the high-performance formulations you please. It's a perfectly good wax for that and I'm sure you could equal or exceed any pre-blend if you're clever. Simply adding some UA or Vybar can be perfectly good.The only problem is with the mottles and maybe rustics, where you're relying heavily on the properties of the base wax. It's not well suited for that IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Margaritamama Posted February 4, 2006 Share Posted February 4, 2006 Oh well...... guess I'll just use the 1343 with vybar for candles other than mottles!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topofmurrayhill Posted February 4, 2006 Share Posted February 4, 2006 Oh well...... guess I'll just use the 1343 with vybar for candles other than mottles!!Don't be sad. My take is that it could prove to be an opportunity. You delved into the things that interested you initially and did very well getting the hang of them. Learning more about additives and other kinds of candles you can make will open a new world of creativity to branch out into. In the meantime, get some 4045H and discover how much better your mottles and rustics can be. In pursuit of Taoist simplicity, I would suggest using just stearic with it. You can buy 343 if you wish but it's far from necessary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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