What FO supplier do you recommend for constant reliability / quality?

[SRez]

 

Meaning, if I receive a 1oz sample today that I like and order a 16oz bottle of it a year from now... will it be the same oil / recipe as the sample and will burn the same as the sample did a year prior? 

 

Noting that nothing else will change on my end… same package of wicks, same lot of wax, vessel etc. 

 

I have plenty of samples as well as larger bottles from different suppliers that are working for me.  I would like to order more of what I currently have but also trying to avoid starting from scratch / tweaking because of FO reformulations and the lack of communication to their customers. 

 

Or is it more of an issue with the manufacturers of the oils making changes and not letting the supplier know about a slight recipe change with the lot / batch?  I would assume once they have something down that they would continue to produce the same product to the milligram.  Am I asking for too much?

 

Off the top of my head, I have samples and larger bottles from AFI, Aztec, Candle Cocoon, Candle Science, Fragrance Buddy, Midwest, Nature's Garden and possibly a couple of others.  

 

So… who are your fav’s and go-to and never a letdown?     

[Belinda]

Midwest has some great oils and always adding more but they're relatively new. I don't see them changing anything though like Candle Science has.

Nature's Gardens

Fragrance Buddy

Flaming

Aztec

 

Those have been around a while and haven't changed as far as I know.

[SRez]

Thank you @Belinda 

[SRez]

I'm just thinking about it now and forgot to mention...

I have a sample from Aztec, Georgia Peach, from possibly end of last year/beginning of this year.

I then ordered 2 more samples of the same oil when they had their sale in July/August.

I compared the oils and they smell different oob. The newest samples smelled peachy while the older sample did not. I don't recall if the original sample smelled peachy to begin with.

 

Could the oil be bad? Different manufactured date and batch?  Maybe it will smell the same like the new samples when burned?

 

I realize this is part of the game not having 100% control of manufacturing and being dependent on others. 

 

Oh the challenges 🤪

[TallTayl]

I’m not sure if any current retailer is immune from reformulations. labs use the raw materials in their inventory to blend “recipes” for their customers. The result is only as good as the ingredients. Fragrances contain countless aromachemical ingredients that may vary from lot to lot from their own suppliers. Or they may need to sub given market shortages, arriving at something “close enough” in spec that most people won’t detect. 
 

each lab uses their preferred diluent also. Those diluents carry their own undertone in fragrance blends. Some diluents perform better/worse in some waxes.  I’ve not followed any diluent changes/shortages. Most people don’t give much thought to that part, until something goes awry. 
 

Some, as you discovered, maybe are not aware a reformulation happened. Others are, and make notes on the listings. I wish ALL retailers would include lot numbers so at least we have a heads up to retest as needed. 
 

I seem to get the most consistency over time with retail brands like crafters choice. Rustic escentuals/aroma haven have been pretty consistent over the years, though I have not purchased much of anything from these places in he past year, so fingers crossed it is still true. 

[SRez]

14 minutes ago, TallTayl said:

I wish ALL retailers would include lot numbers so at least we have a heads up to retest as needed. 
 

I seem to get the most consistency over time with retail brands like crafters choice. Rustic escentuals/aroma haven have been pretty consistent over the years, though I have not purchased much of anything from these places in he past year, so fingers crossed it is still true. 

That would be too easy don't you think?  They include lot #'s on wax so why can't / won't they slap a lot # on the bottle label?  I would assume that the drums, or whatever size they receive them in, has a manufactured date etc.  

 

I actually purchased a 4oz bottle of lavender 40/42 from crafters choice a couple of weeks ago.  I read about it in another thread where you mentioned it.  For the price I paid for it I'm almost unsure what application to use it in.  It's only 4oz.  

 

 

 

  

[TallTayl]

1 minute ago, SRez said:

That would be too easy don't you think?  They include lot #'s on wax so why can't / won't they slap a lot # on the bottle label?  I would assume that the drums, or whatever size they receive them in, has a manufactured date etc.  

 

I actually purchased a 4oz bottle of lavender 40/42 from crafters choice a couple of weeks ago.  I read about it in another thread where you mentioned it.  For the price I paid for it I'm almost unsure what application to use it in.  It's only 4oz.  

 

 

 

  

Yes the drums have the manufacturing info on them (lot number, dates, etc.). I think it’s a matter of the printed label stock for bottles not being customized.  Like they buy thousands of pre preprinted labels at a time. Or maybe their print system doesn’t include that option? 
 

lavender 40/42, in theory, should smell exactly the same from source to source.  It is the oil from the lavender plant, tweaked in the linalool and linalyl acetate components to provide consistencies between crop harvests, etc. I use lavender 40/42 in pretty much all products from candles to soap. It’s one that I have never felt the need to batch test.  I hope I didn’t just jinx myself.

[SRez]

@TallTayl I just double checked the usage rate and realized that I purchased the 40/42 from WSP and not CC.  Anyway...  Does the scent last in CP soap?  I haven't tried EO in soap but have been reading where EO's don't last that long as FO in soap?  Is 40/42 the exception to this rule in your experience?  I'd rather try it in CP than testing for a wick in a candle.... I think. 🤔

[TallTayl]

18 minutes ago, SRez said:

@TallTayl I just double checked the usage rate and realized that I purchased the 40/42 from WSP and not CC.  Anyway...  Does the scent last in CP soap?  I haven't tried EO in soap but have been reading where EO's don't last that long as FO in soap?  Is 40/42 the exception to this rule in your experience?  I'd rather try it in CP than testing for a wick in a candle.... I think. 🤔

Quite a few EO last very well in soap.  In my process (CP) and formula lavender 40/42 lasts for at least a year. Once cured I package in glassine bags. 
 

other EO that I use often, and last strongly for me include:

litsea cubeba (sometimes sold as may chang). Strong lemon scent.

lemongrass

rosemary

spearmint

peppermint

patchouli

blood orange

orange 5x, 10x

lemon 5x

lime-cold press

tea tree

frankincense

eucalyptus

Could it be that many who have not experienced longevity with EO are not getting great quality EO? 

the list of FO that do NOT last as long is much longer. 🙄

[SRez]

20 minutes ago, TallTayl said:

Quite a few EO last very well in soap.  In my process (CP) and formula lavender 40/42 lasts for at least a year. Once cured I package in glassine bags. 
 

orange 5x, 10x

lemon 5x

 

Could it be that many who have not experienced longevity with EO are not getting great quality EO? 

the list of FO that do NOT last as long is much longer. 🙄

That quite possibly could be the case 🙂 .  I just looked up lemon 5x.  Is that the one from Lebermuth or is 5x also considered "5 fold"?  A quick search of 5x brought me to a couple of different results.  

[TallTayl]

5x and 5 fold are the same, yes.  
lemon can be more fugitive than other citrus. A blend with may chang/litsea cubeba helps give it staying power in soap. Full disclosure, I swapped to lemon verbena by AromaHaven/rustic Escentuals the last time lemon EO prices got crazy.  I’ve not used lemon EO in soap for years since I loved the lemon verbena.  The same lemon verbena FO works remarkably well in all of my candle waxes too, so win. 
 

if you’re looking at citrus oils (specifically oranges) , hurricane Ian damage is going to have a ripple effect soon. 

[SRez]

1 hour ago, TallTayl said:

5x and 5 fold are the same, yes.  
lemon can be more fugitive than other citrus. A blend with may chang/litsea cubeba helps give it staying power in soap. Full disclosure, I swapped to lemon verbena by AromaHaven/rustic Escentuals the last time lemon EO prices got crazy.  I’ve not used lemon EO in soap for years since I loved the lemon verbena.  The same lemon verbena FO works remarkably well in all of my candle waxes too, so win. 
 

if you’re looking at citrus oils (specifically oranges) , hurricane Ian damage is going to have a ripple effect soon. 

Good to know! 

 

And yes, good point regarding Ian. 

 

Thank you!

[Belinda]

On 9/29/2022 at 1:40 PM, SRez said:

 

Meaning, if I receive a 1oz sample today that I like and order a 16oz bottle of it a year from now... will it be the same oil / recipe as the sample and will burn the same as the sample did a year prior? 

 

Noting that nothing else will change on my end… same package of wicks, same lot of wax, vessel etc. 

 

I have plenty of samples as well as larger bottles from different suppliers that are working for me.  I would like to order more of what I currently have but also trying to avoid starting from scratch / tweaking because of FO reformulations and the lack of communication to their customers. 

 

Or is it more of an issue with the manufacturers of the oils making changes and not letting the supplier know about a slight recipe change with the lot / batch?  I would assume once they have something down that they would continue to produce the same product to the milligram.  Am I asking for too much?

 

Off the top of my head, I have samples and larger bottles from AFI, Aztec, Candle Cocoon, Candle Science, Fragrance Buddy, Midwest, Nature's Garden and possibly a couple of others.  

 

So… who are your fav’s and go-to and never a letdown?     

Apparently they all could have had changes and I'm just not picking up on it or just haven't ordered an FO that has changed. TallTayl has way more experience and knowledge about all of this than I do for sure. I was going off of the changes that Candle Science has gone through over the last few years reformulating their oils to "clean" scents and people are complaining they're not the same but like she said, all suppliers are apt to have changes due to one thing or another. 

The peach scent you mentioned may have been old when they sent it to you but I've not noticed any changes OOB. I don't use a whole lot of Aztec oils anymore even though I have tons of them. I switched when their Fruit Loops and Monkey Farts wouldn't soak up in aroma beads and didn't have a strong scent in wax. I still order from them (mostly wax) and they still have some good oils, I've just been using other oils that I like better, if that makes sense. To be honest, like most of us on here, I just have WAY TOO MANY TO BEGIN WITH!!! LOL!

[SRez]

14 minutes ago, Belinda said:

To be honest, like most of us on here, I just have WAY TOO MANY TO BEGIN WITH!!! LOL!

Ha! I hear you on that one! I have way too many and trying to narrow down at this point which ones I want to play with. 

[Belinda]

1 hour ago, SRez said:

Ha! I hear you on that one! I have way too many and trying to narrow down at this point which ones I want to play with. 

I keep saying I'm going to do that too but every time a suppliers comes out with new scents I feel like I just have to try them! Then I go right back to using what I like LOL! 

If you haven't tried Midwest Fragrance Co. they have some really good oils, great customer service and they're expanding all the time. They have a group on Facebook and they're so helpful too. Just sweet people. The owner's mom is on here also. It's her daughter and son in law that started the business and they're just booming!

[SRez]

1 hour ago, Belinda said:

I keep saying I'm going to do that too but every time a suppliers comes out with new scents I feel like I just have to try them! Then I go right back to using what I like LOL! 

If you haven't tried Midwest Fragrance Co. they have some really good oils, great customer service and they're expanding all the time. 

Haha! Yup!

 

I actually have a few oils from Midwest. Haven't tested quite yet. I'm in the same boat as you 😁