Candles & Supply Coconut

[jmspgh]

I got an email earlier this week about a new "Coconut Brew Container Candle Wax" from Candles & Supply.  Has anyone checked this out yet or know what it might be?  I am still very new to candle making but so far have been messing around the Calwax CCN1 from Swans.  I don't believe they are the same thing as I was told the CCN1 is not vegan and the C&S one says that it is vegan.

[jmspgh]

oops...forgot to include this

 

https://www.candlesandsupplies.net/Coconut-Brew-Container-Candle-Wax-per-10-11-lb.-slab?sc=7&category=333096

[Laura C]

I have not tried that new coconut wax but I'm curious about myself. Maybe someone has and will share info with us.

[NicoleE]

I just ordered the Coconut Brew from Candles and Supplies and I’m not sure I’m sold. I have only tested one of my scents with it so far and what I’ve found is that it pours beautifully and burns evenly but the appearance of the candles is not pretty. The tops are not smooth (followed all instructions from the vendor as far as mixing and pouring tips). There is frosting of course but also cracks and some bumps. Heat gun doesn’t make a difference. I’ve tried to find what I can do but I don’t see reviews out there on this specific blend. I took a chance and ordered a 45 lb case because I thought nothing could be worse than the sinkholes with IGI 6006. Now I’m kind of regretting it. But continuing to test with my other FO’s (10% load) to see if I see a difference. So far, while they are cooling what I see on the tops is the same. I hope more people will have some feedback on this blend because I need to make it work.

[jmspgh]

I ordered 10 pounds to experiment with but life got busy and I haven't had the chance yet. I'm hoping to in the next few weeks. I'll let you know how it goes.

[NicoleE]

That would be awesome! 

[jmspgh]

I just started my testing of this wax. Followed the recommended temps of heating to 180 and pouring at 140. When they first cooled the tops had a lot of frosting and cracking but after I used the heat gun they looked quite nice with only minimal frosting. I was so excited to start testing wicks that I forgot to take pictures. I didn't add FO to this batch because I wanted to see how the wax performed alone first.

 

I think I overwicked slightly because with my previous coconut wax I added beeswax to harden it but I am trying it without this time.

[NicoleE]

I’m still testing with this wax also. I was able to get less frosting and no cracking at all pouring immediately after mixing FO. I was also disappointed in the hot throw of this wax but tried ultra strong fragrance oils that seem to do well with it. 

[Laura C]

On 8/29/2020 at 9:38 PM, NicoleE said:

I just ordered the Coconut Brew from Candles and Supplies and I’m not sure I’m sold. I have only tested one of my scents with it so far and what I’ve found is that it pours beautifully and burns evenly but the appearance of the candles is not pretty. The tops are not smooth (followed all instructions from the vendor as far as mixing and pouring tips). There is frosting of course but also cracks and some bumps. Heat gun doesn’t make a difference...

 

Hi @NicoleE. Here's my thoughts on it. I'm a perfectionist as I'm sure lots of us are (LOL) but after years of making candles I really try to not sweat the small stuff. I got hung up on that issue with soy candles for a few years and realized it's impossible to get rid of unless you lower your soy % and/or add other waxes or additives to it. Then you even open yourself up to other possible issues. LOL 😀

 

Candle Top Appearance:

I don't have a problem with the way the candle tops look, I think they look fine. Lots of customers don't even notice or care about ripples, pitting or small cracks. Don't forget, that coconut wax does have soy in it and those are natural characteristics of soy wax and I would market it as such. It appears that candle tops and wax melts don't "have" to be blemish free to be big sellers. Have you seen some of the stuff at department stores and big box stores? Not all of those have smooth or level tops.

 

Candle Performance:

For me the performance of the candle is more important than minor blemishes. Did that candle burn safe, clean, even and have strong hot and cold throw?

 

Have you asked any friends or family what they think? I'd say "look at these candles I made, what do you think?" Don't point out any flaws or anything about them before hand, just see what they notice. That can be interesting.

 

[jmspgh]

On 9/13/2020 at 3:09 PM, NicoleE said:

I’m still testing with this wax also. I was able to get less frosting and no cracking at all pouring immediately after mixing FO. I was also disappointed in the hot throw of this wax but tried ultra strong fragrance oils that seem to do well with it. 

@NicoleE have you done any more testing with this wax?  I just poured a few fragrances to try and wanted to see if your hot throw improved at all?

[NicoleE]

I’ve had good HT with a few ultra strong fragrance oils I’ve tested from Northstar Candle Supply. They are formulated for soy and other natural waxes. Problem is, I use wooden wicks. I haven’t gotten the fragrance load right just yet so I’m still testing. Throw has been amazing with these but the wicking is now the challenge. With my regular FO (mostly from Candle Science) I found the HT was much better with patience. With parasoy I can cure for 24-48 hours and get a decent throw when burn testing. With this wax, not so much. I had a friend test some for HT and after shipping they had probably cured for about a week. She said they were amazing!

[Jayefrojersey]

I have been using their coconut wax for a year or so now. I love it ! Easy to use and gives a beautiful white wax that stands out! Great hot and cold throw. 

[NicoleE]

Which coconut wax from them @Jayefrojersey? Is it the coconut brew or another? I noticed the description says bright white but none of my candles have been bright white. More of an off white. 

[jmspgh]

On 9/28/2020 at 11:04 PM, NicoleE said:

Which coconut wax from them @Jayefrojersey? Is it the coconut brew or another? I noticed the description says bright white but none of my candles have been bright white. More of an off white. 

I have been testing the coconut brew wax. It's been a cream/white color for me. I've ordered two separate slabs so far. They have a few other coconut waxes but I haven't tried those.

[prs7979]

I made some candles and melts with this (one FO with three different wicks) will report back once it's cured sufficiently.

[prs7979]

I did my first burn last night.

 

I made some melts earlier and haven't gotten that strong a throw out of them.   I like the texture for melts but it is a bit crumbly.

 

I made three candles with VC's Blueberry Cheesecake at 8% and used these 8oz jam jars.

https://www.communitycandlesupply.com/proddetail.php?prod=JJS8-NOLID

 

I know it's better to do baseline tests but since this FO has been giving me fits as far as wicking and I have this sample slab I figured why not give it a shot?   I used my two most used wicks (CD-6 and HTP-83) and a CSN-7 wick since apparently there's a little palm in here.

 

I burned them all together so even though it throws spectacularly (not a surprise with that FO) I don't know how they all did relative to each other.   Depending on how the burns go I'll end up putting them in different rooms to test them out.

 

Anyways here's the results of the first burn

 

HTP-83, CD-6, CSN-7 from left to right

.  

 

 

At first glance I'm thinking CD-6 may be the best.  CSN may be tunneling and HTP-83 has little enough hangup that it makes me nervous about the bottom of the jar.   

 

More tests obviously to come.

[Lizzy]

Y'all need to stop enabling me! LOL
I just ordered 10 lbs to test. 
I like the look of the CD 6 best too. I will start with CD's. Thanks for the update

[NYC Candle Gal]

So glad I found this thread. I've been using the EC26 Coconut/Soy Wax and am curious about the new Coconut Brew Wax. Anyone have any comparisons on these two waxes? I love the way EC26 looks - perfectly smooth tops every time. Cold and Hot throw are good but not amazing. I am wondering does the new Coconut Brew wax have a better cold/hot throw than the EC26?

 

Thanks y'all for the input!

[On The Road Supply Co]

On 10/14/2020 at 8:28 AM, Lizzy said:

Y'all need to stop enabling me! LOL
I just ordered 10 lbs to test. 
I like the look of the CD 6 best too. I will start with CD's. Thanks for the update

omg right?? As if i needed another wax to play with??? 🤣🙃😇

[friendlysoutherner]

Finally ready to be brave and share my results! Switched completely to the C&S coco brew as I was only using coco83 before it disappeared for so long 🤪 I've performed many preliminary tests before selling any, and lo and behold on the second batch of candles I was putting up for sale I encountered ALL the issues that didn't arise in testing!! I did reach out to C&S and they were very helpful, so here's what I've got-

 

Tested heating to 170, 180, 190, even 200 and 210 (that was more of an accident lol) for different rounds. Added FO at 160, 170, 180, 190 and 200 (respectively). Some I stirred for at least 2 minutes, but started noticing SO MANY air bubbles when I test burned, so I did another round of stirring less than 30 seconds (which is not even a thing, and I still had plenty of tiny air bubbles when burning). I'm thinking in ALL my testing and pouring for sale, I'm pouring too soon after stirring, and I also haven't poked any of these at all. This also means if I use heat gun for smoothing out the tops, all those tiny air bubbles cool on the surface (see photo).

Another issue I've almost always had is frosting on the top. It kind of goes away after using heat gun on the top, but this just brings up the air bubbles to the surface. Then I'm constantly fighting them away with the heat gun just for a perfect top!

 

Lastly, I used the heat gun on a batch where I overheated the wax and it was scorched and turned almost a peachy creamy color. I came in this morning and there was SO MUCH SWEAT!! Can't believe it! (photo #2)

 

Any tips or feedback from your experience (even with other similar waxes? I can tell this one has WAY more soy than coco83, which is the only wax I've ever worked with).

 

 

[TallTayl]

Whoa, that is some crazy seepage. Thanks for sharing! I have seen this wax advertised along with a slew of other newcomers to the market hungry for the big gap left when accublend could not produce coconut83 for a few months. 
 

what fo % are you using?
 

I would be curious about the inside texture.  Is it riddled with grains? When soy wax grains the wax molecules are just too big to trap fragrance and boom seepage (syneresis). No amount of blotting will solve the problem as it runs through the entire candle and can cause pooling - especially concerning toward the bottom where heat can cause safety issues. 

 

as for bubbles, do you mean from hidden cavities beneath the surface, or like champagne bubbles throughout the wax as it heats?
 

if cavities, you may need to adjust pouring temps to allow the candle to cool more evenly and not suck air down the wick as it shrinks. Until you get your legs under you with this new wax you may want to poke relief holes in the cooled candle to expose the hidden cavities and heat gun or second pour to fill so the candle burns well and does not hit a hole causing a flare.
 

if champagne bubbles, C3, for instance, is famous for releasing loads of crazy bubbles while heating that are not easy to release even through pouring and cooling. Seems their as though their additives love to trap air, like soap bubbles. 

[friendlysoutherner]

12 minutes ago, TallTayl said:

Whoa, that is some crazy seepage. Thanks for sharing! I have seen this wax advertised along with a slew of other newcomers to the market hungry for the big gap left when accublend could not produce coconut83 for a few months. 
 

what fo % are you using?
 

I would be curious about the inside texture.  Is it riddled with grains? When soy wax grains the wax molecules are just too big to trap fragrance and boom seepage (syneresis). No amount of blotting will solve the problem as it runs through the entire candle and can cause pooling - especially concerning toward the bottom where heat can cause safety issues. 

 

as for bubbles, do you mean from hidden cavities beneath the surface, or like champagne bubbles throughout the wax as it heats?
 

if cavities, you may need to adjust pouring temps to allow the candle to cool more evenly and not suck air down the wick as it shrinks. Until you get your legs under you with this new wax you may want to poke relief holes in the cooled candle to expose the hidden cavities and heat gun or second pour to fill so the candle burns well and does not hit a hole causing a flare.
 

if champagne bubbles, C3, for instance, is famous for releasing loads of crazy bubbles while heating that are not easy to release even through pouring and cooling. Seems their as though their additives love to trap air, like soap bubbles. 

 

Thanks for the response!

From what I can tell they don't seem grainy. But, they also aren't as perfectly pretty as coco83 always was 😆

 

For the second photo (black pots with seepage) - I am certain I didn't use more than 9% FO (it was somewhere between 7.5-8.5% - these pots are about 9 oz so for each one I use about .75 oz FO + 8.25 oz wax). My main thought would be this was the last round I did where the wax was over heated for a prolonged time (close to 200 degrees for well over 24 hours). I was adding FO immediately, stirring for about 1 minute, then pouring immediately. Thing is - the seepage didn't happen until a day or 2 after it was set and had been heat gunned. This particular batch (unlike the other photo) is a fragrance blend, and it's from 2 different suppliers. Could it be that this wax isn't friendly with all FOs? But I certainly agree with you in that I need to pour much cooler.

As for the bubbles, I think I am dealing with both. The top photo showing the one burning best represents the bubbles at that point- they don't really appear until the candle is lit, and then it is champange-y. However, when I use the heat gun on some others it is typically bubbles that seem like cavities - bubbles rise to the surface squeezing out right by the wick and then cool on the surface unless I chase them down constantly. Hopefully this photo represents that difference well. 

[Kerven]

Wax and FO incompatibility does exist. What FO are you using?

CS Black Sea was a bad one for me, especially in coconut blends. It made one tester look more like a foamy sponge than wax.

[friendlysoutherner]

2 hours ago, Kerven said:

Wax and FO incompatibility does exist. What FO are you using?

CS Black Sea was a bad one for me, especially in coconut blends. It made one tester look more like a foamy sponge than wax.

 

the one that seeped in the photos is Flaming Candle's Sandalwood Vanilla with CS Mulled Cider and Chestnuts

I did have a few with CS caramelized pralines that sweat a tiny bit, but not nearly as bad. (is it obvious I'm working on my fall fragrances?🤣)

[prs7979]

I will provide pictures later when I'm at home but I separated the three candles to test scent throw.   I had the CSN7 in the room I make candles and after I had a little accident with my Halloween FO you couldn't smell anything.

 

The HTP83 and CD6 smell continue to be very good, burns still good on both.   One odd aspect is that they struggled a lot on the second burn.   They did both "push through" it and now have a nice stable flame on them.

 

I will take pictures but it should be noted that I accidentally let my CD-6 go a little bit longer than I intended to so they're no longer lined up timewise.