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Candybee

Making lotiony feeling handsoap

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I get asked for 'hand' soap a lot. Recently I used a technique I have previously used in making liquid soap and shaving soap pucks. And that is to add an extra superfat and glycerin after the cook.  By extra superfat I mean I did a superfat in my calculations then added extra fat after the cook in addition to that.

 

Also, I was recently asked to custom make a soap for a recovering cancer patient with very sensitive skin and I superfatted it plus added an extra fat after the cook along with some glycerin. I used a recipe that was high on the conditioning side with low cleansing and bubbly properties. The batch of soap came out super soft and took a few days extra to harden up. I tried a bar and found it very mild and it left my skin feeling extra soft conditioning to the skin.

 

So now I am thinking of making a line of hand bar soap and wondering how far I can push the envelope to make your hands feel lotiony soft and conditioned after washing.

 

I wanted to hear from others if they use techniques to make a particular soap that makes their skin feel like they not only washed but leaves it feeling like they used lotion on it too.

 

I've made soaps high in animal fats like lard and animal fat shortening/crisco that feels amazing on your skin but it does not feel quite like lotion.

 

Thinking of using shortening in my hand soap recipe... or maybe it could be my superfat. Soap will also have a high amount of castor and I want olive oil and sunflower for their high amounts of vitamin E. 

 

Another ingredient that leaves an amazing feel to your skin is adding lanolin, the anhydrous waxy kind, to your batter after the cook. I do this for my shaving soaps. The problem with that is I have to consider it is an allergen ingredient for folks that have an allergy to wool. But I have never had one complaint from my customers that bought shaving soap and it clearly states lanolin on the ingredients label.

 

Any thoughts or ideas would be appreciated.

Edited by Candybee

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The only way I know of to perfectly dial in your superfat to a specific fat is to make a 0% SF High Temperature Fluid Hot Process and then to add the exact fat(s) you want to use as the SF content at the end of the cook as you are adding in your sodium lactate, FO, colorants, extra sugar, and milk. I've got a Soapcalc somewhere that has my exact method listed out on it. The NICEST SF content I had found is Olive oil. It feels nicer than Shea or Coconut Oil to me.  My HTFHP soap never needs more than 5% SF to get a super nice, lotiony feeling, high lather soap. You could try even as much as 7% SF if you wanted a really greasy feeling soap. I'll see if I can dig it up. 

Slainte, 

Sponiebr
The Executor of Bad Ideas and Sundry Services.  

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The only thing I can remember is my 100% olive oil soap. I made it for babies and those with sensitive skin. This soap never lathered, it was more lotion like. I discontinued it because in the end folks want lather and lots of it!

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50 minutes ago, Sponiebr said:

The only way I know of to perfectly dial in your superfat to a specific fat is to make a 0% SF High Temperature Fluid Hot Process and then to add the exact fat(s) you want to use as the SF content at the end of the cook as you are adding in your sodium lactate, FO, colorants, extra sugar, and milk. I've got a Soapcalc somewhere that has my exact method listed out on it. The NICEST SF content I had found is Olive oil. It feels nicer than Shea or Coconut Oil to me.  My HTFHP soap never needs more than 5% SF to get a super nice, lotiony feeling, high lather soap. You could try even as much as 7% SF if you wanted a really greasy feeling soap. I'll see if I can dig it up. 

Slainte, 

Sponiebr
The Executor of Bad Ideas and Sundry Services.  

 Here it is...

 

1004765015_HTFHPcurrentformulation.jpeg.f36a0bae97cf94a26c48a7ff26ebb634.jpeg

It was converted from a PDF to jpeg so the clarity isn't all that great, sorry about that. 


Sponiebr
The Executor of Bad Ideas and Sundry Services 

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I like your shortening in your recipe and that was also what I was considering. I don't see what you used as your superfat unless you are referring to the yogurt? zOr were you just saying you use 68gm of oil for your superfat to get 5%?

 

I already did a 5% superfat in my calculations so my recipe will end up with 5% of my oils unsaponified. I am doing an additional superfat after the cook. The reason I do the additional superfat is so I know that particular fat will not be saponified. So I can choose which fat/oil I want unsaponified. I typically add in 1oz fat/oil per lb of the total oils recipe. So for a 2 lb batch I would add in 2oz of fat.

 

I have done the additional superfat using either lanolin or cupuacu butter. Lanolin feels outstanding as an added superfat and works well in my shaving soaps. For those that want a vegan shaving soap I use cupuacu butter which is the closest in retaining moisture properties as lanolin. Adding in glycerin adds another dimension to moisturizing and adds glide and easier mixing and pouring of the batter too. But the feel to your skin is really nice.

 

I just have not made a soap specific for a hand soap so thinking out load about what I may use to formulate my recipe and technique.

 

Keep the suggestions coming. I learn a lot by what others have to say or add.

Edited by Candybee

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1 hour ago, CandleRush said:

The only thing I can remember is my 100% olive oil soap. I made it for babies and those with sensitive skin. This soap never lathered, it was more lotion like. I discontinued it because in the end folks want lather and lots of it!

 

I don't like it either. Too slimy for my taste. Not what I would call lotiony but thats JMO.

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That shortening recipe reminds me of the first soap I made. I didn’t have a mold so I lined a shoe box. It worked. I saved the last bar and years later it was just as good. I think a super long cure helps tame soap.

 

In my cold process soap I use heavy cream for most of the liquid. I like to think my soap is gentle. Maybe I just like cream!

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10 hours ago, Candybee said:

I like your shortening in your recipe and that was also what I was considering. I don't see what you used as your superfat unless you are referring to the yogurt? zOr were you just saying you use 68gm of oil for your superfat to get 5%?

 

I already did a 5% superfat in my calculations so my recipe will end up with 5% of my oils unsaponified. I am doing an additional superfat after the cook. The reason I do the additional superfat is so I know that particular fat will not be saponified. So I can choose which fat/oil I want unsaponified. I typically add in 1oz fat/oil per lb of the total oils recipe. So for a 2 lb batch I would add in 2oz of fat.

 

I have done the additional superfat using either lanolin or cupuacu butter. Lanolin feels outstanding as an added superfat and works well in my shaving soaps. For those that want a vegan shaving soap I use cupuacu butter which is the closest in retaining moisture properties as lanolin. Adding in glycerin adds another dimension to moisturizing and adds glide and easier mixing and pouring of the batter too. But the feel to your skin is really nice.

 

I just have not made a soap specific for a hand soap so thinking out load about what I may use to formulate my recipe and technique.

 

Keep the suggestions coming. I learn a lot by what others have to say or add.

That walmart shortening is DA BOMB! innit? FWIW I've NEVER been able to manually calculate out the same values in soap calc using just PO and Beef Tallow, I strongly suspect there's some hydrogenation in there somewhere that is accounting for the differences in SAP and INS. 

Ok, so if you're adding in 1oz SF PPO then you're doing a 6.25% SF which should be LOVELY in HP soap by itself. I personally wouldn't go over 8% in HP for SF content. I have been attacked by the DOS demons before and I am now skittish. 

Personally, (this is just my preference), I wouldn't bother to put in ANY SF before the cook. I just dial it to 0 and then (in that particular formulation) add in the 68g of OO to get a 5% SF content. (I think that was 5% of the total oil weight) . I figure WHY? I'm PUTTING in a specific oil as the SF anyway, and in the the way I do my  HTFHP I CAN'T miss the addition of the SF, or FO because if I did it would NEVER get out of the pot, so adding in ANY SF before the cook is completely unnecessary. (I mean, TO ME it is)  If I make it a smidge lye heavy and my SF is 4.98% then so be it, and if it's a tad SF and my end SF content is 5.03%, meh... I'm ok with that. I've found those weird SF to be more prone to DOS than say a pure OO SF. 

In HP it's the same before the cook as if doing CP,  you CAN'T KNOW what the superfat content* is made up of. The lye chooses from your fat content what it will, and won't saponify. Your SF content in any CP soap therefore is most likely a blend of ALL of your fats, though it's probably not much of the CO, PO, or Animal Oil, and NONE of the EO, and esters (waxes).  

Now, as to your lanolin feeling wonderful as a SF, I would say YOU BET IT DOES! 1. because lanolin's AWESOME, and 2. because lanolin is an ester and therefore unsaponifiable. If using an ESTER as your SF you STILL have to basically calculate it as 0%SF, and then add it in manually. Soap calc does this for you in some of these, like lanolin, beeswax, pine tar. You can plug them in to the calculator and it knows to ignore these as a fatty acid and just to factor them into the final volumetric calculation. Yanno, 'cause when you need a quart of soap making 35 ounces is an irritating waste. 


*UNLESS it is an ester that you are using as your "superfat". Technically adding an ester as a "superfat" is a misnomer because an ester CAN NOT BE a fat, because it isn't a fatty acid.

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Sponiebr
The Executor of Bad Ideas and Sundry Services

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*UNLESS it is an ester that you are using as your "superfat". Technically adding an ester as a "superfat" is a misnomer because an ester CAN NOT BE a fat, because it isn't a fatty acid.

 

I understand how superfatting works both before and after the cook. I just like doing both ways. The second superfat for the oil/fat that I know for sure I want unsaponified. Plus the initial superfat will leave a teeny bit more or less of unsaponified oils from each of my recipe oils. Yes I realize it is not necessary I just do it as a preference and feel both add to the feel of the finished soap and its properties. I may change that in the future but for now I want to do it both ways for specific soaps. What got my attention was your thinking about how a specific oil like olive oil feels on your skin as the unsaponified superfat oil. Hope that makes sense. I may try in the future your method of going to "0" superfat and just trying out various single oils for superfatting and see if I like others. So far I have only used lanolin and cupuacu butter. 

 

RE lanolin, yes I am aware it does not saponify and that is one reason why I choose it as a superfat for particular soaps. It just feels amazing on the skin when added.  I just like to add it in after the cook and refer to it as a superfat.

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On 11/21/2019 at 3:05 PM, Candybee said:


What got my attention was your thinking about how a specific oil like olive oil feels on your skin as the unsaponified superfat oil. Hope that makes sense.


Yeah, I tried a BUNCH of them, Olive oil, Coconut Oil, Castor oil, Shea Butter, Lanolin, Beeswax. Of all of them I felt the OO was the nicest, though lanolin was REALLY nice too. I've heard cocoa butter is TDF... I've never tried it, it's just too damned expensive; for me.  

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