Paraffin thoughts?

[candlesinflorida]

Just a general question...why do most high-end candle manufacturers use paraffin? Is it because it holds more fragrance or is it more stable for delivery/shelf life? And do paraffin candles generally have better scent throw?

 

[Sarah S]

I am not a high-end candle manufacturer, lol, but in my experience, yes to all three.

[TallTayl]

Consistency, shelf stability and overall performance top the list IMO. 

[GarthAlgar]

Could be that paraffin has been dominating the market for high end and mass-produced candles since the 90s.  Natural waxes are newer developments and I imagine a lot of overseas candle factories are more comfortable with paraffin wax.  But yes, also consistency, shelf stability, and performance help. 

[Ravens]

In my experience, it boils down to consistency and superior hot throw. 

[candlesinflorida]

Thanks everyone! I started experimenting with one 10 lb bag of paraffin wax, just to see if the scent throw was possibly anything particularly exciting. In my experience, it wasn't. But I was wondering if shipping from overseas/shelf life was a big factor. Thx for the input

 

[Forrest]

I believe that soy and soy blends can match, or possibly exceed the HT of paraffin if given enough time to cure, but in today's world  manufactures want to minimize the time it takes to get their product to the consumer. I have seen some high-end candle makers that use soy blends.

 

[candlesinflorida]

9 hours ago, Forrest said:

I believe that soy and soy blends can match, or possibly exceed the HT of paraffin if given enough time to cure, but in today's world  manufactures want to minimize the time it takes to get their product to the consumer. I have seen some high-end candle makers that use soy blends.

 

That is interesting. I don’t love the HT of the paraffin candles I made-they are strong, but there is an unmistakable hint of petroleum or fuel scent in the air. And the unmelted pellets smell horrible to me. 

Going straight back to soy!  

[blacktieaffair]

I saw a video the other night, from Timber Ridge Gifts, and he did a comparison between para and REALLY high end oil/wax like are use by Jo Malone and others. They were using butter/waxes that we would have to pay a small fortune for. ( the FO alone was $75.00 ) Here's the link. It was very interesting. 

 

 

[NightLight]

The company mentioned there marks up all their prices about 500 percent. You can get the same type of candle fragrances from many of the candle company suppliers mentioned on this board. You can also buy the wax at other companies if you do a search. I believe they buy wax and mark it up and market it as a luxury wax. 

 

What I love with paraffin. It colors beautifully, doesn’t frost, burns wells. Soy can frost, dry out. 

You can create a paraffin candles that doesn’t soot like crazy, but they have to blended.

[Forrest]

14 hours ago, candlesinflorida said:

That is interesting. I don’t love the HT of the paraffin candles I made-they are strong, but there is an unmistakable hint of petroleum or fuel scent in the air. And the unmelted pellets smell horrible to me. 

Going straight back to soy!  

What paraffin did you use? I've been using IGI 4630 and it has worked  very well for me and doesn't smell at all. I use it when I want a candle that is ready to burn in a week. I think your problem may be specific to the paraffin you have. My main was is IGI 6006 which is a paraffin soy blend which I like, but the cure time is pretty much like pure soy.

[TallTayl]

The wick also plays an incredible part in any candle.  Too hot or the wrong material and you will smell “burned” wax and FO. Too small or the wrong type and you won’t get the full impact of the candle. 

 

That video...  where to begin? 🙈. 

[runner14jc]

I think paraffin is also a bit more stable in the long run --- in terms of less prone to lot variations. Those of us who have used soy wax have all seen how it can vary and fluctuate over time and from lot to lot. Companies that are mass producing are not wanting to spend time and energy on extra testing that is often required periodically with soy wax.

[Sebleo]

7 hours ago, TallTayl said:

 

 

That video...  where to begin? 🙈. 

 

Please do!!!! 😂

[bfroberts]

Re: the video
I've been biting my tongue for 22 hours.

[TallTayl]

16 minutes ago, Sebleo said:

 

Please do!!!! 😂

You first 😂

[candlesinflorida]

First off, I can’t wait to sit down and watch that video! What a build-up!! Candle drama

i have been so interested in what Jo Malone does for their candles. I am basically a Jo Malone soy wannabee. I personally WOULD spend more to emulate their wax blends, because I am just like that. Even if just to try it all out.

 

To answer the question about which paraffin...it is Kerax 4105.

got it from the UK. Shipping was crazy but again, no one has ever called me practical when it comes to all this.

[candlesinflorida]

8 hours ago, Forrest said:

What paraffin did you use? I've been using IGI 4630 and it has worked  very well for me and doesn't smell at all. I use it when I want a candle that is ready to burn in a week. I think your problem may be specific to the paraffin you have. My main was is IGI 6006 which is a paraffin soy blend which I like, but the cure time is pretty much like pure soy.

Do you find that the 4630 gives you way better results than a soy-only wax? I usually use GB 464 and it was great...not sure why I even messed with a good thing, but oh well. 

Maybe I will try the 4630z

regarding cure times, I am really guilty of ignoring them for the most part. I have received many “last minute” orders of 70-100 at a time and the turnaround was pdq. I often light candles just after 1-2days bc of impatience. 

[Sarah S]

21 hours ago, TallTayl said:

The wick also plays an incredible part in any candle.  Too hot or the wrong material and you will smell “burned” wax and FO. Too small or the wrong type and you won’t get the full impact of the candle. 

 

That video...  where to begin? 🙈. 

 

Totally agree, I've only gotten a burned or petrol smell when the wick is way too big, or too small, and of course some citrus FOs will get that terrible fuel smell.

 

The video.... sweet baby Jesus, 12% FO load??? With that much FO, the neighbors better be able to smell that candle burning!! 😂😂

I wish I had stopped it before he started talking about the hot throw, I was somewhat on board up until that point, it is an interesting discussion anyway. I feel compelled to point out though, the brilliant white of the super pricey (and difficult to work with!) coconut/apricot blend can also be achieved by using a common paraffin blend like 4630 or CBL 125. So, many of the visual charastics of the luxury candles can be achieved by using common materials. Food for thought!

[Forrest]

17 hours ago, candlesinflorida said:

Do you find that the 4630 gives you way better results than a soy-only wax? I usually use GB 464 and it was great...not sure why I even messed with a good thing, but oh well. 

Maybe I will try the 4630z

regarding cure times, I am really guilty of ignoring them for the most part. I have received many “last minute” orders of 70-100 at a time and the turnaround was pdq. I often light candles just after 1-2days bc of impatience. 

Curing in soy wax is a process that continues for a long time, but the rate of curing slows. Paraffin wax cures much faster. I've been making 8oz tins with 4630 and after a week they have great HT, the same candle made with 6006 needs a month or more to reach that level of HT because it is 30% soy. I suspect that most of the time candles that are being sold have some time between when they are poured and when they are burned. The 4630 has been an easy wax for me to work with and to wick.

[candlesinflorida]

12 hours ago, Forrest said:

Curing in soy wax is a process that continues for a long time, but the rate of curing slows. Paraffin wax cures much faster. I've been making 8oz tins with 4630 and after a week they have great HT, the same candle made with 6006 needs a month or more to reach that level of HT because it is 30% soy. I suspect that most of the time candles that are being sold have some time between when they are poured and when they are burned. The 4630 has been an easy wax for me to work with and to wick.

Do we know the science behind the need for curing to create good HT? Just wondering why the candle would need to sit for longer than merely cooling, to bind “more”. I don’t completely doubt it...just interested in the science behind it.

[blacktieaffair]

I agree with candlesinflorida........... can someone please explain to me why , when using soy, you  need to wait anywhere from 3 weeks to 2 months to get a good HT.  And please , NO OFFENSE to anyone that uses soy , but............. WHY ? Why in the world do you wait so very long to even know if what you did was screwed up or not ? Again, I mean NO offense to anyone.. I just don't "get" it. 

[CandleRush]

Hi!

Well I’m not a scientist but speaking from my personal experience I’m happy to share.

 

Ill start by saying candle making is one big experiment. Lots of variables, change in products, new waxes etc. The recommendations on websites for products are just guides. It’s really up to the candle maker to experiment.

 

The simplest answer I’ve come up with is it takes time for certain wax and fragrance oil to blend. Of course we mix it which does the first part but it will further develop over time.

 

Perfumers mix fragrances and wait weeks for them to develop before they are sold.

 

My own experiment has shown me that after lightning a candle after the so called 3 day wait, close to no hot throw. Ready to pitch the candle and f.o. I decided to keep them, forgot about them and relit a month later with the strongest hot throw. Keep in mind your wicks matter also, more experimenting! My wax is 464 and coconut wax/some paraffin in the blend.

 

Since paraffin throws so well there are many blends to try that might be satisfying, more experimenting!

 

Im ok with waiting for a cure, not all f.o. work the same either. There are some that are strong 1-2 weeks later. Maybe this helps?🌸

 

 

 

 

 

 

[TallTayl]

From what I’ve seen, the polymorphic soy crystals develop and strengthen bonds over time.  Plus, organic waxes continue to evaporate latent moisture remaining from the manufacturing process. Both of these things amount to a hotter, dryer flame which can more efficiently burn fuel and throw it into the air.

 

i’ve had great HT on a 2 day old soy candle that completely flops a couple of weeks / months out. The initial wick was great for a soft-ish damp-ish wax, so by the time the crystallization process finished the wick was not nearly hot enough. And of course vice versa.  

 

Soy (and other natural waxes) do contain a range of moisture. Some cases you open and they feel noticeably wet, while others are crispy and dry. This throws off wicking really badly.  I’m sitting here frustrated that it happened again, with C1 this time. My new cases are initially several sizes off from my last lot. 😖🙈 I will need to age this wax a few months to see if that changes (which I suspect it will).

 

many of these irritating things can be tamed to a degree with paraffin. Paraffin waxes have. More stable crystal structure, are inert and don’t tend to change much, if at all, over time. 

 

[CandleRush]

Well said!

Candle making is not so black and white like we’d like, lots are grey too!