jerry Posted March 19, 2019 Share Posted March 19, 2019 (edited) Good evening experienced cold process soapers. I'm curious about white kaolin clay used to "anchor" fragrances, particularly essential oils, in cold process soap - your thoughts? Does this work? Help? Myth? Thanks very much! Edit to add - if this is in the wrong place - sorry about that! I think of it in relation to essential oils, so I put it here. Edited March 19, 2019 by jerry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iansmommaya Posted March 19, 2019 Share Posted March 19, 2019 This seems like a reasonable place for this discussion. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CandleRush Posted March 19, 2019 Share Posted March 19, 2019 Great question! I’ve used most of the clays in my cp recipes to help with anchoring e.o. especially for some of the citrus oils. They may help a little but what I found is that they increased the lather, added gentle exfoliation and creaminess to the soap. I always add white kaolin clay to every batch I soap I make. If you are looking to add color, the French green clay and rose clay are beautiful. Bentonite clay is another one that can anchor essential oils as well as patchouli, you don’t have to use much! I think you just have to experiment and see what works and take notes.🌸 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerry Posted March 19, 2019 Author Share Posted March 19, 2019 Thank you @CandleRush. I plan to try some in a batch this weekend. I’ve used Bentonite clay in a gentle baby soap and love it for my face, lol, so I look forward to trying other clays. In in terms of anchoring - that’s good to know it’s citrus it helps with...I will certainly give it a try. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CandleRush Posted March 19, 2019 Share Posted March 19, 2019 Your welcome! Clay on the skin feels great! You may like Dead Sea clay in your soap too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallTayl Posted March 19, 2019 Share Posted March 19, 2019 I’m one of the unlucky few that break out with itchy skin when there’s clay in soap. It’s sad because I’m also a potter, so hands in clay... clay dries out skin faster than anything, so if you’re oily maybe it’s a good add. After all, mud masks are used to tighten skin. Lady customers in my area complained sensitive areas (especially bra areas) itched terribly after using soap I had made for them with a tiny amount of clay for color. to anchor scent, well, it’s like chasing unicorns... some EO are just too volatile and fugitive for high pH products like soap. If you want orange, give folded oils a try. 5x or 10x orange sticks fine as opposed to traditional single fold EO. Ditto with lemon. Expressed Lime sticks fine all by itself. Other essential oils such as a touch of patchouli help ground citrus. Another wives tale a few friends swear by is to stick blend your essential oils into castor oil before adding to the soap. Many fragrance oils have essential oil components and stick quite reliably with no tricks. Blood Orange Patchouli by Daystar is one. I sticks in my soap for years. Likewise aromahaven lemon verbena is always a top seller in all products and sticks forever. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shari Posted March 19, 2019 Share Posted March 19, 2019 My experience is the same as TallTayl. I don't use clay in my soap (dries me out) and don't find that it helps anchor scents at all. I tried them very early on in my soapmaking and eventually gave up. I really don't have a problem with most sticking well. Citrus can be a problem but I use lemongrass or 10x orange and some lime and they stick pretty darn well. Patchouli sticks like the dickens for me. I sell a lot of it but keep a bar from each batch. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallTayl Posted March 19, 2019 Share Posted March 19, 2019 15 minutes ago, Shari said: My experience is the same as TallTayl. I don't use clay in my soap (dries me out) and don't find that it helps anchor scents at all. I tried them very early on in my soapmaking and eventually gave up. I really don't have a problem with most sticking well. Citrus can be a problem but I use lemongrass or 10x orange and some lime and they stick pretty darn well. Patchouli sticks like the dickens for me. I sell a lot of it but keep a bar from each batch. Lordy Lemongrass sticks! I accidentally made a 5 lb log using 5% like I would FO a couple years ago and that thing still packs a powerful punch uncut! It made a nice reminder as it mocks me from a shelf over the production area. for lemon scent in an essential oil, hardly anything can compare with the tenacity (and price) of litsea Cubeba (May Chang). Lemon essential oil and folded lemon skyrocketed a few years ago during a brief shortage. Prices never came back to reality. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shari Posted March 19, 2019 Share Posted March 19, 2019 I agree, lemongrass sticks like crazy. I forgot about Litsea. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerry Posted March 19, 2019 Author Share Posted March 19, 2019 Thank you @TallTayl for the reminder that clay is drying...I wonder why my face has felt drier lol. I can be so dense. I love the silky feel clay gives, but the drying...and that would mean that using clay for coloring - rose clay, french green, for example - will make the soap more drying. Thanks for the ideas about folded Eos and using a little patchouli - very helpful too. I do love lemongrass! That is one that has stuck for me, no problem Getting some Litsea for sure. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallTayl Posted March 19, 2019 Share Posted March 19, 2019 While eo’s may seem initially more expensive, those two are super thrifty so you can easily cut back probably by half and still have a very richly scented soap. Those two are good blenders too, though use sparingly. A little lavender 40/42 or lavandin with either is nice. A little patchouli with lavender and a dab of vanilla is TDF. Spearmint, peppermint and rosemary stick like glue too, singly or combined. Eucalyptus blends well with all and also sticks. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerry Posted March 19, 2019 Author Share Posted March 19, 2019 Thank you so much, @TallTayl! I have used in cp soap lemongrass and orange 10x. The Lavender 40/42 that I used in a castille soap - cured for at least 10 months now - has faded a little, but I just started using a bar and I can tell it's there, lol. I'm out, so putting together an order and this really helps narrow the choices, especially when EOs are costly. Is light patchouli ok or should I find some dark? I was going to order from Camden-Grey per @Candybee's rec, but they are out of dark patchouli right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CandleRush Posted March 19, 2019 Share Posted March 19, 2019 That is something to think about if you sell. I like my customers to read my ingredient list especially if they have known allergies or issues. Guess I should have mentioned I use heavy cream for most of my liquids in my recipes maybe that helps? You could super super fat!. It seems to help those with acne, excema and psoriasis , I’m in that category.I’ve got that slightly oily, olivey Mediterranean skin! I love May Chang too! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallTayl Posted March 19, 2019 Share Posted March 19, 2019 @jerry with patchouli all that matters is time. Fresh patchouli essential oil often smells like dirty feet. If you can buy extra and set it aside to Asian to a beautiful syrup it will be sweet and lovely. i bought heavy before the price shot up so I am not sure what Camden’s stock smells like. Liberty Natural is where mine was from I think. Now I need to look at a bottle because I’m not really sure. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerry Posted March 20, 2019 Author Share Posted March 20, 2019 5 hours ago, TallTayl said: Fresh patchouli essential oil often smells like dirty feet. Oh dear. That explains why you and others often say patch is a love or hate thing. And that is not the smell I am recalling from my college days 😂 well, I certainly recall smelly feet, but think of patchouli differently. Looks like this will be an eye opener. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shari Posted March 20, 2019 Share Posted March 20, 2019 I purchase a dark Indonesian Patchouli from here: http://www.fragrancelaboratory.com/store.html#!/Patchouli-Oil-Dark-Indonesian-Essential-Oil/p/36089366/category=9255019 It was recommended by a long time soapmaker on another forum. It's a really good seller for me for the past 6 years. I have a few customers who order an entire batch or 2 each year. It's dark and earthy and has grown on me. And the price I find is extremely reasonable. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CandleRush Posted March 20, 2019 Share Posted March 20, 2019 Patchouli is so great blended with other essential oils. Lately patchouli and Bulgarian rose absolute in perfume is stunning. check out EDen Botanicals, they have both a light and dark version of patchouli, I love both. Patchouli is one of those oils that get better with age. I have some 10 yrs. old and just gets better! I don’t get the dirty feet smell but you know everyone’s olfactory system is different. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerry Posted March 21, 2019 Author Share Posted March 21, 2019 Thank you!!! @CandleRush I meant to mention that I made my first batch of cp with coconut milk last weekend - I bet your cream soaps are divine. That's a fun experiment to look forward to. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerry Posted March 21, 2019 Author Share Posted March 21, 2019 @Shari thanks for the tip - that's very reasonably priced! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CandleRush Posted March 22, 2019 Share Posted March 22, 2019 Jerry, coconut milk is fabulous in soap too! I found the best way for me is to add the milks/creams in my oils first, stick blend a bit then add lye and of course blend more. These soaps do take longer to set up, sometimes I leave them in my round molds 2-3 days but in 4-6 weeks they are cured perfectly. My first soap recipe was made with crisco! That’s all I had in the house at the time, we always have olive oil here. After I mixed it I poured it in a shoebox lined with parchment paper. Cutting it into bars was so rewarding! Hook, line and sinker at that point! Looking back it was one of the best soaps. I saved a bar and years latter, still great. Sounds like your having fun!🌸 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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