Web Marketing - Websites

[Quentin]

On 12/12/2018 at 11:12 AM, Paintguru said:

 

Thanks.  I checked them out, and they are pricey, but as you said, a better deal may be available.  It is monthly rate, correct?  And when you say your B12 site gets updated when you update your store, do you mean your Etsy store or another one?  

 

Also, do you have a link to your B12 site?

"It is monthly rate, correct?"  It's one of those offers that you're seeing more and more of each day for internet services/downloads. It's similar to the same tactic that all the charities and companies offer on TV: "Send in your monthly contribution of $15.00 a month [automatic debit of course] and you can feed a child for a whole year, decade, century, blah, blah, blah... That's just 50 cents per day. Less than you'd pay for a bottle of Coca-Cola"  50 cents a day is still $15.00 a month or $180 a year. Sometimes paying it all in one lump sum might save you $5.00 on an annual basis. You get the idea. After all, who can't afford to part with only 50 cents every day? Right?

[TallTayl]

A monthly subscriptions is not the worst. Doing the math, I pay $100  a year plus $2 a month for my web host (insanely low compared to new services.).

$100 a year for SSL

 

total for self hosting about $225.  IF starting out now, that figure would be considerably higher since most hosts want a heck of a lot more than I'm paying on a legacy host.

 

a hosted site for $29 per month comes out to $348, an extra $125 a year.

 

Benefits: no more hassles of installing add-ons, bug fixes,programming, security patches, themes, etc.

 

[Paintguru]

32 minutes ago, TallTayl said:

A monthly subscriptions is not the worst. Doing the math, I pay $100  a year plus $2 a month for my web host (insanely low compared to new services.).

$100 a year for SSL

 

total for self hosting about $225.  IF starting out now, that figure would be considerably higher since most hosts want a heck of a lot more than I'm paying on a legacy host.

 

a hosted site for $29 per month comes out to $348, an extra $125 a year.

 

Benefits: no more hassles of installing add-ons, bug fixes,programming, security patches, themes, etc.

 

 

I'm not against monthly subscriptions, but as @MilosCandles stated, if I'm just starting out with limited sales, I probably want to start on the inexpensive side.  However, I'm sure customers don't want to see me changing systems every 5 seconds as I grow.  I'll check out Bigcommerce; I do like the all in one option, and with my semi-limited time, I'd prefer to spend my time, as you said, marketing and making product.

[Quentin]

1 hour ago, TallTayl said:

A monthly subscriptions is not the worst. Doing the math, I pay $100  a year plus $2 a month for my web host (insanely low compared to new services.).

$100 a year for SSL

 

total for self hosting about $225.  IF starting out now, that figure would be considerably higher since most hosts want a heck of a lot more than I'm paying on a legacy host.

 

a hosted site for $29 per month comes out to $348, an extra $125 a year.

 

Benefits: no more hassles of installing add-ons, bug fixes,programming, security patches, themes, etc.

 

I agree, those fees are not too high. I wouldn't be able to do it at all without paying someone to help me, not to mention the time it already takes away from my production time.

[Quentin]

47 minutes ago, Paintguru said:

 

I'm not against monthly subscriptions, but as @MilosCandles stated, if I'm just starting out with limited sales, I probably want to start on the inexpensive side.  However, I'm sure customers don't want to see me changing systems every 5 seconds as I grow.  I'll check out Bigcommerce; I do like the all in one option, and with my semi-limited time, I'd prefer to spend my time, as you said, marketing and making product.

I feel your pain. However, the "inexpensive side" may not get you any business at all. It's possible it may never get noticed at all by the consumer. Therefore, you might end up spending more in the long run. Let me say though that Milos's approach of starting with a Facebook page then adding Etsy and linking the two together is good sound advice. I would add my own suggestion to get signed up with Square, buy their card scanner that plugs into your cell phone. That way you have a method of taking payments at remote locations such as shows, flea markets, etc. They only charge you when you take a payment, but paying them something is better than losing any sale.

[TallTayl]

Totally get it.  I wanted "free" at first in exchange for the IT knowledge I already had.  In the end, I'm convinced it harmed my online sales. A crappy web site does not help instill confidence in my customers...

 

Do check out how easy shopify is to work with.  Point click, drag drop. super user friendly.

 

The USPS and credit card discounts also help defray the monthly costs.

[Paintguru]

8 hours ago, TallTayl said:

Totally get it.  I wanted "free" at first in exchange for the IT knowledge I already had.  In the end, I'm convinced it harmed my online sales. A crappy web site does not help instill confidence in my customers...

 

Do check out how easy shopify is to work with.  Point click, drag drop. super user friendly.

 

The USPS and credit card discounts also help defray the monthly costs.

 

So you'd still go Shopify vs. Bigcommerce for newer folks?  

 

8 hours ago, Quentin said:

I feel your pain. However, the "inexpensive side" may not get you any business at all. It's possible it may never get noticed at all by the consumer. Therefore, you might end up spending more in the long run. Let me say though that Milos's approach of starting with a Facebook page then adding Etsy and linking the two together is good sound advice. I would add my own suggestion to get signed up with Square, buy their card scanner that plugs into your cell phone. That way you have a method of taking payments at remote locations such as shows, flea markets, etc. They only charge you when you take a payment, but paying them something is better than losing any sale.

 

 

Yeah, I have a Square account and was thinking of going with their free web store to start (along with Etsy/FB).  I guess it depends what your future customers expect.  

[TallTayl]

FWIW, I’ve never once been asked if I have a Square store.  I am asked regularly if I’m on etsy. People know and trust etsy. 

 

Mot sure what Square does to promote its sellers, if anything.

 

given the choice between Shopify and big commerce I would choose the latter only based on what I’ve kicked the tires on for the last several days. Why pay the same for fewer features? 

 

 

[Paintguru]

11 hours ago, TallTayl said:

FWIW, I’ve never once been asked if I have a Square store.  I am asked regularly if I’m on etsy. People know and trust etsy. 

 

Mot sure what Square does to promote its sellers, if anything.

 

given the choice between Shopify and big commerce I would choose the latter only based on what I’ve kicked the tires on for the last several days. Why pay the same for fewer features? 

 

 

 

The Square store replaces the Shopify/BC part of things, not Etsy.  It is a very basic one page store, which for candles, may not be bad.  It is free, but again, has very limited features compared to Shopify/BC.  Decisions decision!

[Laura C]

16 hours ago, TallTayl said:

FWIW, I’ve never once been asked if I have a Square store.  I am asked regularly if I’m on etsy. People know and trust etsy. 

 

That comment brings up a great point. Just off the top of my head, I remember people ask me if I'm going to be selling on Amazon/handmade, Etsy or my own website. So I agree, Etsy and Amazon are definitely on people's minds for shopping, especially for handmade.

[birdcharm]

If you're selling on etsy and you want to use a website to draw people to your etsy shop, then you could create a very simple site using a template or creating your own html/css.  You could also use Paypal payment buttons for any items shown on the site if you don't want to get fancy.  The traffic generated on a simple page may not be so great though with only a page or two, however, as the search engines seem to prefer content.  I could be wrong, but I think websites that are mostly shopping carts may not get picked up as much by the search engines as pages that have regular pages, articles, etc. with lots of keywords and content.

[Paintguru]

1 hour ago, birdcharm said:

If you're selling on etsy and you want to use a website to draw people to your etsy shop, then you could create a very simple site using a template or creating your own html/css.  You could also use Paypal payment buttons for any items shown on the site if you don't want to get fancy.  The traffic generated on a simple page may not be so great though with only a page or two, however, as the search engines seem to prefer content.  I could be wrong, but I think websites that are mostly shopping carts may not get picked up as much by the search engines as pages that have regular pages, articles, etc. with lots of keywords and content.

 

Right, or do you just have a URL that points to your Etsy store and call it a day?  I assume the main point of having your own site is to save on the listing fees that Etsy charges, and of course, the ability of someone to stumble across you via "Googling".  Perhaps it depends if one plans to generate business locally via craft fairs, farmers markets, etc., where customers can reorder via the website, or if one plans to simply run online and generate customers from Etsy/Amazon.    

[TallTayl]

Etsy, to me, is to gain customers I would never reach in person. Etsy customers are quite loyal to etsy and don’t often feel comfortable shopping outside of etsy, even if the product is less expensive elsewhere.  To me, the fees are super cheap. It’s far less expensive for me to sell to someone new on etsy than to pay for marketing or drag myself to craft shows all over the world. 

 

My own site is for those i have cultivated myself. It costs more in the end to do it this way until and unless sales reach a point where they offset the fixed costs. On your own site you have to pay for the hosting, templates and technical stuff.  3% per Sale and $.20 per listing on etsy is a bargain for the global reach it has. 

 

each has its advantages.  

 

Since i sell in person at one summer event per year, I rely on etsy for new customers for the other 9 months. 

[Quentin]

22 hours ago, Paintguru said:

 

So you'd still go Shopify vs. Bigcommerce for newer folks?  

 

 

 

Yeah, I have a Square account and was thinking of going with their free web store to start (along with Etsy/FB).  I guess it depends what your future customers expect.  

I think the "Square account and going with their free web store to start (along with Etsy/FB)"  is a good, sound plan. I wish I had started out smaller instead of the way I did. Now, I'm feeling overwhelmed to the point of inaction.  I jumped right in without giving it much thought. Unfortunately, that just seems to be my nature.  To say that I have a limited knowledge of things internet and e-commerce would be a gross understatement and would be a much more generous thing to say about me than I deserve. After reading what you, @Paintguru , have posted over the last few weeks I sense a caution on your part that I wish I had. 

 

3 hours ago, birdcharm said:

If you're selling on etsy and you want to use a website to draw people to your etsy shop, then you could create a very simple site using a template or creating your own html/css.  You could also use Paypal payment buttons for any items shown on the site if you don't want to get fancy.  The traffic generated on a simple page may not be so great though with only a page or two, however, as the search engines seem to prefer content.  I could be wrong, but I think websites that are mostly shopping carts may not get picked up as much by the search engines as pages that have regular pages, articles, etc. with lots of keywords and content.

 I can't disagree with anything that birdcharm said here. However, when you bring the Facebook page thing into play and use it to direct people to your Etsy shop and your Square page, you've pretty much done an end run around the search engines. Not an end run on the scale of Alabama, Notre Dame, Clemson and Oklahoma but probably better than my favorite team could do. They are now resting in the cellar of the S.E.C.  Facebook reaches almost everyone in the Milky Way galaxy. That's a lot of humans AND extraterrestrials <<<<<<<----------- Spell check says I got that right so I'm sticking with it. Go with the plan you just laid out there. It seems to make sense to me.

[Paintguru]

6 minutes ago, Quentin said:

I think the "Square account and going with their free web store to start (along with Etsy/FB)"  is a good, sound plan. I wish I had started out smaller instead of the way I did. Now, I'm feeling overwhelmed to the point of inaction.  I jumped right in without giving it much thought. Unfortunately, that just seems to be my nature.  To say that I have a limited knowledge of things internet and e-commerce would be a gross understatement and would be a much more generous thing to say about me than I deserve. After reading what you, @Paintguru , have posted over the last few weeks I sense a caution on your part that I wish I had. 

 

Ha, well I did have a Wix account for a year that I never did anything with, so I totally get the overwhelmed into inaction point.  Plus, with the cost of insurance what it is, I need to prioritize where my investment goes at the start.  And don't get me started about bad football teams, I went to U of Illinois...I'd just be happy with a good basketball team!  

[Quentin]

2 minutes ago, Paintguru said:

And don't get me started about bad football teams, I went to U of Illinois...I'd just be happy with a good basketball team!  

As they say, "there's always next year". We (Ole Miss) were actually going somewhere in football. The we cheated and the N.C.A.A knocked us out. Our downstate rival turned us in. Since I'm a gentleman and a good sport I won't mention their name (Mississippi State).

 

[MilosCandles]

So there are few GOOD and BAD points with Etsy.

 

1 - ETSY already has a customer base which creating your own website would never have.  Millions of customer go to ETSY everyday to purchase stuff.

2- There are MANY vendors on ETSY, on your own website there is just you.

 

Early on I was running some facebook ads to my ETSY store.  This is good for me, but even better for ETSY.  I was paying for the AD that directed them to ETSY.  Who won?

 

Now when I run ADS it is to my website.  

 

Here is a VERY interesting stat,  The AVERAGE sale on my website is almost 75% higher than on ETSY.  When customers go to my website I have them captive with all my candles.  On ETSY they are just doing search after search adding 1 item to their cart at a time.  This was eye opening for me.

 

It was well over 2 years after I started that I created a shopping cart website.  It was a lot of work.  It has paid off for me.

[MilosCandles]

I will say this..  ETSY is still my #1 revenue source.  You need to find a niche, you need to find your spot on there.  Do not discount the power of Etsy.  It is a good starting point.  Do lots of reading on ETSY SEO, Ranking, Keywords, Titles.  I really looked into this a year ago and had good success and then continued to tweak my listing.  All of this is a lot of work.  DO not overwhelm yourself.  Set a goal,  small goal.  Get 10 candles listed on ETSY.  Get you pictures.   Get description. EVERY few months my store grows and changes. 

 

I now also have an AMAZON Handmade store.  But that only has like 25% of the items that my ETSY store has.  I will continue to grow it over the next few months.

[Quentin]

On 12/17/2018 at 12:39 AM, MilosCandles said:

It was well over 2 years after I started that I created a shopping cart website.

Shopping cart site? Could you list an example or two? I'm not sure I'm familiar with the term. I must not be familiar with the term or I wouldn't be asking you this.

[aptommo]

4 minutes ago, Quentin said:

Shopping cart site? Could you list an example or two? I'm not sure I'm familiar with the term. I must not be familiar with the term or I wouldn't be asking you this.

 

Any online shop that allows you to add items to your cart then checkout and pay all on the same site.......ie: all our suppliers

[Quentin]

3 minutes ago, aptommo said:

 

Any online shop that allows you to add items to your cart then checkout and pay all on the same site.......ie: all our suppliers

So basically the sites we've been discussing. Just a different name for all the Etsy, Amazon and others. Thanks.

[MilosCandles]

1 hour ago, Quentin said:

Shopping cart site? Could you list an example or two? I'm not sure I'm familiar with the term. I must not be familiar with the term or I wouldn't be asking you this.

Yes @aptommo is accurate..   I guess in my mind I was excluding ETSY and AMAZON.  was thinking more along the lines of my own website with a shopping cart..   ie.  Woocommerce, shopify, square etc...

[KrisS]

Thank you all for this conversation.  Truly useful information.  I just picked up a few (more) domains at significant cost savings in comparison to my existing registrations. 

 

One regret I'll share with you guys as a learning experience. I've kicked my own rump several times for not picking up "coconutcandles" when it was available at a decent price 4-5 years ago. If there's something you keep going back to as a domain you want, there's a reason for it.  Nab it before someone else does. 

[Crafty1_AJ]

On 12/17/2018 at 12:39 AM, MilosCandles said:

So there are few GOOD and BAD points with Etsy.

 

1 - ETSY already has a customer base which creating your own website would never have.  Millions of customer go to ETSY everyday to purchase stuff.

2- There are MANY vendors on ETSY, on your own website there is just you.

 

Early on I was running some facebook ads to my ETSY store.  This is good for me, but even better for ETSY.  I was paying for the AD that directed them to ETSY.  Who won?

 

Now when I run ADS it is to my website.  

 

Here is a VERY interesting stat,  The AVERAGE sale on my website is almost 75% higher than on ETSY.  When customers go to my website I have them captive with all my candles.  On ETSY they are just doing search after search adding 1 item to their cart at a time.  This was eye opening for me.

 

It was well over 2 years after I started that I created a shopping cart website.  It was a lot of work.  It has paid off for me.

 

Another advantage of Etsy is the word-of-mouth advertising you get.  If you have loads of 5-star feedbacks, you're more likely to make the sale.  I routinely will have a run on a certain scent.  I'll check into why...inevitably, it's positive feedback from a customer.  That's golden stuff.  As TT mentioned, great photos are crucial.  So is unsolicited positive feedback from customers, and the ability for potential customers to see that.  

[candlesinflorida]

On 12/18/2018 at 11:54 PM, MilosCandles said:

Yes @aptommo is accurate..   I guess in my mind I was excluding ETSY and AMAZON.  was thinking more along the lines of my own website with a shopping cart..   ie.  Woocommerce, shopify, square etc...

Just wanted to keep this thread going in 2019 and see if anything had changed in your mind?

 

I have a store on Wix. Love it, works well and look great...but hearing a lot about shopify and wondering if I should research the differences. I have a square reader for the phone, for markets. 

 

I don't want to do Etsy, and probably not Amazon, for the reasons you cited above. To me, the customer has too many choices that all look the same bc they are all "in" Etsy and prices are too competitive and low. I love to shop on Etsy, but not sell there. Same with Amazon.

 

I just set up my instagram last week (totally late to the social media party, I know) 

Learning all about instagram marketing and now, facebook marketing. So I guess I should set up a FB store and link to instagram and people can click instagram pics to go to FB store and BUY direct via facebook? (More direct for customers than linking to my website on Instagram because of the way Instagram sets it all up).

 

And is Twitter a must-do?

 

Are the companies mentioned in 2018 (B12 and other companies that manage these things) still a good idea? Not sure how any of those work or what they are.

 

Doing this all myself is taking way more time than the candle-making

 

 

 

 

Edited June 26, 2019 by candlesinflorida