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Linda P

C3 / Coconut 2 outcome part 2

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Here's my report from yesterday's wax testing. I made 4 candles: C3 / Coconut 2 80:20 and 70:30; C3 / USA 98:2; NorthWood Coconut 100%. 

I used clean 9 oz straight sided jars. I followed mfr's instructions for heating and pouring temps (for C3, heating temp 185,F pouring temp 165F. for NW coconut, heating temp 200 & poured immediately). No dye. No FO. No wick. No second pour. 

 

Yesterday, I didn't fill each container to the jar shoulder as I did the previous day. I left a little room at the top for a second pour if necessary. I also tapped each jar on the surface of the table several times as soon as I'd poured to help any air bubbles surface. I slowed down my heating process a bit so I could stir thoroughly and slowly before reaching the heating temp max, with the hope that would give air bubbles a chance to escape.

 

Overall, I'm happier with how this batch of candles turned out. Once again, no signs of frosting or wet spots on any of the jars, more evidence that I need to prep my jars by cleaning in ammonia and Dawn dish detergent. No obvious signs of air bubbles in this batch, and all the tops came out smoother than my last batch. The only candle that made me sigh in frustration was the C3/usa candle. You'll see why below.

 

So here are the photo results:


1. ⬇︎ C3:Coco 2 80:20 There's a slight dip in the center of the candle. Also, there's a tiny crack around the circumference about 1/8-inch from the edge of the jar. A sign that the candle cooled from the outside in? Except for those imperfections, this is the look I'm trying to achieve.

 

IMG_20180615_064744.thumb.jpg.a8b13d620bc1e1295c77973a43f70630.jpg

 

That wax on the jar above the candle is what splashed up when I tapped the bottom on the table to release air bubbles.

IMG_20180615_075722.thumb.jpg.4a8a9adebdf67df9c80ccc4894578d1c.jpg

 

2. ⬇︎ C3:Coco 2 70:30 No dip in the center, but there's an indent with a crack. I poked a hole in it and there doesn't seem to be a sinkhole below that dip/crack. There's a similar tiny crack 80:20 around the circumference.  The 70:30 and 80:20 are really close in finished appearance. IMG_20180615_064830.thumb.jpg.6aed150b433e752d170940f8dd447d74.jpg

 

More wax splashing up the side from tapping the jar on the table.

IMG_20180615_075744.thumb.jpg.5203ed682c32bd30f4006892c7568660.jpg

 

3. ⬇︎ C3:usa 98:2 Most disappointing candle of the bunch. The usa helped some re: the appearance of the top, but not enough. Two big bumps and a crater, and the crater is covering an air pocket. Also, cracking around the circumference 1/4-inch from the edge.

IMG_20180615_064859.thumb.jpg.c427b038d5d10a6f551a6e9c26b2cd80.jpg

 

I really wanted C3 to work as a standalone wax with a little help from an additive. Maybe experimenting with cooling/pouring temps will give me better results.

IMG_20180615_075804.thumb.jpg.58a12077b87ae030f60609c9e12c4457.jpg

 

4. ⬇︎ Northwood Coconut wax 100% There's a small dip in the center of the candle. It's about the same size and depth as the dip in the 80:20 candle (#1 above). No sign of a sinkhole though. And no cracking around the circumferenceIMG_20180615_064924.thumb.jpg.79a43e76df28d27c8d8adf8b7bca2078.jpg

 

Based on appearance alone, this Northwood coconut wax candle turned out the best. It's soft—I can easily push a turkey lacer into it. But when I press my finger on it, I don't leave a fingerprint. So it's firmer than the C3/coco 2 40:60 I made yesterday. How will it do in hot weather? We might get up to 92 air temp today, so this afternoon, I will set all 7 candles out in the sun and see what happens. 

 

Oh, I noticed one small wet spot on this candle jar. I'm thinking I missed a spot when I cleaned this jar. 

IMG_20180615_075827.thumb.jpg.a26273dbbb5dfde9a4b2949b485d13de.jpg

 

Conclusion: Based on these 7 candles, the 80:20 and the 100% Northwood coconut candle turned out the best. I'll know more after the outdoor sun/heat test this afternoon and the wick/burning tests next week after curing.

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The C3 with USA will look nicer as you experiment with pour temps and cooling rates. With all blends, take care to thoroughly blend.

 

c3 continues to harden for weeks. The blend(s)  with coconut will become more firm on the surface with time. I dug intoall of my lends and discovered they remain a texture much like packaged cake frosting. The melt behavior, though, is what you where see the most change, and will have the most fun wicking. 

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13 minutes ago, TallTayl said:

The melt behavior, though, is what you where see the most change, and will have the most fun wicking. 

Oh goody?!?

 

Good to know about c3 hardening over time. Northwood says their coconut wax can be burned with only 2-3 days cure time. Don't plan to try it that soon, just because I want to give them all at least a week before wick testing. I'll have to remember to take notes before I start wicking to see if any of them changed in appearance.

 

I kinda figured the C3 with USA needed experimentation with pouring temps and cooling. As do the C3 with coco 2 blends because of those circumference cracks. 

 

Question: At what temp do you add fragrance to c3? It has to be added early enough after reaching heating temp to give yourself time to thoroughly mix and then time to let the air bubbles rise before reaching your pour temp of 120-125. 

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12 minutes ago, Linda P said:

Question: At what temp do you add fragrance to c3? It has to be added early enough after reaching heating temp to give yourself time to thoroughly mix and then time to let the air bubbles rise before reaching your pour temp of 120-125. 

185. 

 

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Update on these candles under an excessive heat warning. Outdoor temp is 94F, and the candles were outside in the sun for 2-3 hours. The Northwood coconut and the C3/coco 40:60 candles had little beads of sweat on the surface, caused by what I don't know. No dye or FO in either. From the outside, the NW coconut candle looked like it was on the verge of becoming liquid. It's melting point is 112F, so yeah, 8° away from melting. Except it still felt somewhat firm to touch. Firmer than the 40:60 candle, which had pretty much turned to slush on top. The rest of the bunch decreased in sweat and increased in firmness in proportion to soy:coco ratio. As I'd expect. The 80:20 and 70:30 candles didn't suffer much, if at all, from the heat. 

 

The weird one was the C3/usa candle, which also had a bit of sweat, and was turning soft on top, to the point that I could move the wax.

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The beads are probably the lower melt point fractions of the oils. Each oil/wax is made up of MANY individual fatty acids, each with different melt points.

 

To be fair, being in direct sunlight is a pretty severe test. Adding fragrance would further lower the melt point of each of these candles. How would they be in a closed mailbox or in the shade?  I need to do a final test of my own when it gets to a decent temp here again. We're enjoying a little break from oppressive heat right now...

 

The coconut waxes are using some sort of gellant. I'm not sure which, but have tried several here in my lab. That explains the appearance and feel of NW.

 

Soy wax is particularly unstable. It's polymorphic and changes feel continuously. That is why soy candles stored away "grow" and grain (frost). Minute changes in temp and humidity can accelerate the changes. The lower melt point fractions of the soy were rearranging in the sun. USA is a type of emulsifier/stabiliser.

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Ah. Well, I wasn't trying to be fair, really. The opposite, in fact. I wanted to see what would happen in an extreme circumstance. Today's weather presented an opportunity, and I took advantage, just to see. All part of getting to know these waxes, even if I don't know what's going on under the microscope.

 

What you said about the beads being fatty acids with lower melt points... Very cool. I'm not a scientist in real life, dream life, TV, or anyone's dictionary. My eyes blur reading the MSDS sheets when those are available. Nevertheless, the technical, chemical, physics side of candle making intrigues me. Plus, fire! 

 

Good point about the addition of fragrance. I can say now with some certainty that I won't be using a blend of more than 50% coconut. Although I'm curious about blending the NW coconut with C3, which I haven't done yet.

 

Yeah, soy. I've got some dyed soy candles I made in December and one I purchased. The way those things frost, grain, whatever, while burning and recooling... well, they look like layered candles. Part of the joy of soy, I guess. Before I got interested in making candles, I didn't pay any attention. Now I'm fascinated by the changing properties of soy wax.

 

I've got more discoveries ahead once I start wicking and burning this batch.

 

Thank you for all your info and explaining what I'm seeing. 

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On 6/15/2018 at 10:01 AM, Linda P said:

Oh goody?!?

 

Good to know about c3 hardening over time. Northwood says their coconut wax can be burned with only 2-3 days cure time. Don't plan to try it that soon, just because I want to give them all at least a week before wick testing. I'll have to remember to take notes before I start wicking to see if any of them changed in appearance.

 

I kinda figured the C3 with USA needed experimentation with pouring temps and cooling. As do the C3 with coco 2 blends because of those circumference cracks. 

 

Question: At what temp do you add fragrance to c3? It has to be added early enough after reaching heating temp to give yourself time to thoroughly mix and then time to let the air bubbles rise before reaching your pour temp of 120-125. 

Just an FYI  Northwoods Coconut wax is COCONUT 83 from Accublend.. it can also be found at California Candle Supply.. this wax is a blend of coconut, apricot, soy, palm

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@Linda P I really love how you tested this wax. so detailed! For the 100% Northwood coconut candle what was the best wick to use with that? Heard so many different things but would love to know your opinion. 
Also just curious when you do wax blends (For example soy and coconut). How do you know what temperature you heat up to, when to add fragrance and when to pour since they both are two waxes? 

 

Edited by Ruru

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