Anyone interested in discussing perfume ingredients?

[glasllyn]

I'm starting to experiment with perfuming and it's mostly been with fragrance oils and carrier oils. I'm interested in using aroma chemicals individually, but I'm no chemist, and I'd like to learn more about others' experiences with things like fixatives, bases, mixtures, and all sorts of other things that go into perfume making.

[KrisS]

I've been considering this more and more seriously lately.  The fun part of all of this has always been mixing, matching, and creating something that can't be found anywhere else.  I'm frustrated with wax.  I'm frustrated that FO suppliers disappear overnight.  This sounds like something else fun I can be frustrated about.

[Sarah S]

I can hardly keep up with all my hobbies now, but this is something I would love to delve into at some point.

I will certainly be following the conversation with great interest, even if I have nothing to add to it!

[Crafty1_AJ]

I've made solid perfumes.  Those are fairly easy.  Use a good lip balm or lotion bar base and add a bit of body safe fragrance.  We used to pour them into small lip balm pots.  We dressed them up with a light dusting of cosmetic glitter.  Stopped making them due to lack of time, but they were fun.  At one point, we had about 20 or so varieties.

Edited February 28, 2019 by Crafty1_AJ
fix

[CandleRush]

I’ve only been making perfume with essential oils I purchase from Eden Botanicals. I make solid perfume using bees wax and a combo of carrier oils. I first started with everclear and it’s great to work with but you can’t sell it due to the alcohol. Also make roll on perfume using e.o. with perfumers alcohol and or carrier oils. I’m playing with mixing e.o.with fragrance oils because e.o. have their limits. Perfume making sites are helpful. One thing I can’t stress enough is letting your blends cure for 2-4 weeks before adding anything else. It does make a difference. I also cure my candles now. The blends do improve over time. Base Notes is a perfumers forum that has lots of info and helpful. I’m sure there are talented folks here too that might chime in.

[Shari]

I've made solid and roll-on perfume for 8 years.  Solid didn't sell as well as roll-on so I discontinued them for several years.  Going to bring them back this year and see how it goes.  I put them in oval lip balm tubs for convenience.  I purchased some perfumers alcohol but haven't used it as yet.  I want to make some perfume for myself.  I've looked for nice inexpensive perfume bottles to possibly sell but haven't hit on anything I really like.

[iansmommaya]

YYYYYYYYYYEEEEEESSSSSSS!

 

I am so here! Loving this! OMG! YAY!

[Darbla]

The simplest roll-on recipe I've seen yet is clear, deodorized jojoba + scent.  The key here is "clear, deodorized"; I've seen jojoba mentioned in numerous places but the jojoba I currently have alters scents just a bit.  Since I see sales from Elements from time to time, I was considering ordering the jojoba from there.  Is this really a decent recipe, or is it TOO simplistic and needs improving?  I'm not selling so this is for me only.  I want to make some roll-ons of all those rose scents I've been going on about.

 

https://www.elementsbathandbody.com/perfume-roll-on-recipe/

 

[CandleRush]

Interesting about the deodorized jojoba. I’ve only used the regular kind. Never noticed a scent. I use it in perfumes, lip balms and salves for me color is not an issue but I may try it. The recipe is simple and that’s what is nice about it. It gets complicated when you mix fragrances/ e.o. Together. But do take lots of notes!!! I made a lovely perfume using e.o.s and when I wanted to reproduce it to sell, no notes.

i also love using fractionated coconut oil for my roller perfume, saving the good stuff ( jojoba) for my face.

 

[TallTayl]

Jojoba is nice, as is fractionated coconut oil. The FCO is colorless and odorless with a very long shelf life.

 

a little cera Bellina or hydrophobic silica makes it a gel that holds mica shimmer really well. 

 

The lerfumers apprentice and creating perfume are both great for some harder to find aromachemicals. 

[Darbla]

Is perfumer's alcohol radically different than a body spray base?  Do our FOs act differently in one than the other?  Couldn't you just use the same concentration of FO in the body spray base that you would in the perfumers' alcohol and have the same result?  Maybe not but that's what I need to know.  I'm trying to figure out if I want to order perfumers' alcohol that I have no experience with, or if I would get the same results just concentrating the FO a bit more in body spray. 

[Darbla]

I think I'll run by the liquor store and get some 190 proof Everclear.  I always forget about that because I'm not in the habit of making perfumes (yet), but I bet with the shipping costs of our supplies these days that's going to be about as cheap if not even cheaper.

[CandleRush]

Sorry , did not see this till now.

everclear works great with essential oils, I do the drop method, start with 3-5 oils one drop of each. Let it blend 1-2 weeks, adjust by adding more or less of each. You can add a few drops of everclear before or after the waiting period. Take notes!

 

Eden Botanical has a tutorial on mixing and blending. It’s where I get my oils from, top notch.

 

Vetiver Aromatics has a guide and ingredients to make professional grade perfume.

I think if you use fragrance oils that are skin safe a body type spay solution works well. These usually have some moisturizing in them. You can find them at most candle and soap making distributors. There are more than one type depending on what products you make.

Hope this helps🌸

 

 

[Sarah S]

On 5/17/2019 at 3:44 PM, Darbla said:

Is perfumer's alcohol radically different than a body spray base?  Do our FOs act differently in one than the other?  Couldn't you just use the same concentration of FO in the body spray base that you would in the perfumers' alcohol and have the same result?  Maybe not but that's what I need to know.  I'm trying to figure out if I want to order perfumers' alcohol that I have no experience with, or if I would get the same results just concentrating the FO a bit more in body spray. 

 

I think the problem would be that most body spray bases from suppliers are formulated to only hold up to a certain percentage of fragrance oil before you get separation and other issues. Usually it's only around 2-5%. For a good, strong, long lasting perfume, you really need a concentration more like 10-20% fragrance.

I suppose if you were using a base that was water, glycerine, and an emulsifier like polysorbate, you could get around that by adding more polysorbate to the base, but that would take some experimenting.

 

On 5/17/2019 at 5:27 PM, Darbla said:

I think I'll run by the liquor store and get some 190 proof Everclear.  I always forget about that because I'm not in the habit of making perfumes (yet), but I bet with the shipping costs of our supplies these days that's going to be about as cheap if not even cheaper.

 

I use grain alcohol (the kind that's makes you go blind if you drink it straight, 😂), and it works great. I only make it for me, I don't sell it.

Edited May 19, 2019 by Sarah S
Grammar!

[Darbla]

43 minutes ago, Sarah S said:

I think the problem would be that most body spray bases from suppliers are formulated to only hold up to a certain percentage of fragrance oil before you get separation and other issues. Usually it's only around 2-5%. For a good, strong, long lasting perfume, you really need a concentration more like 10-20% fragrance.

 

One comment I've seen (after I posted those questions above, of course) is that a higher alcohol content is needed to dissolve the oils.  Maybe a body spray has enough to dissolve 2-5% of oils, but not 10-20%?  I ordered some spray bottles so after they arrive I'll stop by a liquor store somewhere.

[Darbla]

I bought 60 oz of Everclear for $32.61 at a local liquor store.  Getting 32 oz of perfumer's alcohol was going to $30-$40 (shipping is included in that) at all the sites I looked at online.

 

Just posting in case it helps someone else with price comparison.

[CandleRush]

Here’s my bottle!

[Darbla]

@glasllyn how is your experimenting going?  I put 20% of WSP's Falling In Love dupe in the Everclear I mentioned above but I get mostly a blast of alcohol.  Maybe 20% isn't the best ratio.  That blast of alcohol is the same issue I have with most non-designer body sprays & perfumes, and even with some expensive designer ones.

[glasllyn]

On 7/1/2019 at 8:44 AM, Darbla said:

@glasllyn how is your experimenting going?  I put 20% of WSP's Falling In Love dupe in the Everclear I mentioned above but I get mostly a blast of alcohol.  Maybe 20% isn't the best ratio.  That blast of alcohol is the same issue I have with most non-designer body sprays & perfumes, and even with some expensive designer ones.

I haven't had much time to dedicate to it. Whatever alcohol you're getting should die down shortly after spraying, allowing the scent to remain. Since WSP's IFRA says you can go up to 45%, you can certainly double the FO, but you may also prefer to add your FOs to FCO instead of alcohol and use it as a roll-on.

[Darbla]

How is your perfume making going?  When you've made a spray with alcohol, does it take a while for it to "settle" or for the ingredients to meld into their final result or something?  I feel like I might be getting an "off" note from the Everclear I mentioned above, but I figured this would be an even better option than perfumer's alcohol since it won't have that extra ingredient making it undrinkable.  So my next thought was maybe this will age a little and be better.  I seem to be having better luck with rollerballs and they smell great from the beginning, though I have not made a rollerball of the same FO that I made into sprays.  I've used 20% FO in the total solution in each application.

[Darbla]

It's been a couple weeks now and I'm very happy to report that "off" note is gone.  (side comment:  WSP L de Lolita Lempicka is a great vanilla sandalwood)   I have a blackberry vanilla musk that has a play-doh note already in the bottle so I'm going to try it like this and see if that also is something that mellows out.  If it does I would enjoy that for perfume the rest of this Summer.

[GhostHauntings]

On 6/5/2020 at 8:58 AM, Darbla said:

It's been a couple weeks now and I'm very happy to report that "off" note is gone.  (side comment:  WSP L de Lolita Lempicka is a great vanilla sandalwood)   I have a blackberry vanilla musk that has a play-doh note already in the bottle so I'm going to try it like this and see if that also is something that mellows out.  If it does I would enjoy that for perfume the rest of this Summer.

 

How did your perfumes turn out? It sounds like you've had somewhat of a success with them? I've done a ton of research and everybody keeps saying to stay away from those FO's, saying they are only formulated for soap and candle making, and won't smell good when added with perfumers alcohol. I'd love to hear anybody's experience with this as I'm not trying to be a professional perfumer and just want to make these for myself. I am specifically looking at using WSP's FO's.

[Darbla]

On 5/9/2021 at 2:11 AM, GhostHauntings said:

 

How did your perfumes turn out? It sounds like you've had somewhat of a success with them? I've done a ton of research and everybody keeps saying to stay away from those FO's, saying they are only formulated for soap and candle making, and won't smell good when added with perfumers alcohol. I'd love to hear anybody's experience with this as I'm not trying to be a professional perfumer and just want to make these for myself. I am specifically looking at using WSP's FO's.

 

That blackberry & vanilla one had simply gone bad (these chemicals do break down after a while) and was not going to work out in anything.  But L de Lolita Lempicka is great.  Any fragrance oil that works in soap should be fine mixed with perfumer's alcohol (or Everclear, which is the same thing) or a body spray base.  If you like the scent, make it up as a sample size perfume and see how it goes.  That way you're not wasting much if you end up not liking it.

[GhostHauntings]

@Darbla I've actually been playing around the past month/month in a half with different fragrances and am loving it so far. I made my spouse some colognes and he loves them. I use 95% Ethanol and have had some really good results. I'm going to grab some Fractionated Coconut Oil and some roller ball bottles and try to make roll-ons next as I think these would do even better as oil perfumes. Your old posts here are pretty much what made me take the jump into it and I'm glad I did!

[Julia Rabi]

 

On 2/28/2019 at 3:09 AM, CandleRush said:

I’ve only been making perfume with essential oils I purchase from Eden Botanicals. I make solid perfume using bees wax and a combo of carrier oils. I first started with everclear and it’s great to work with but you can’t sell it due to the alcohol. Also make roll on perfume using e.o. with perfumers alcohol and or carrier oils. I’m playing with mixing e.o.with fragrance oils because e.o. have their limits. Perfume making sites are helpful. One thing I can’t stress enough is letting your blends cure for 2-4 weeks before adding anything else. It does make a difference. I also cure my candles now. The blends do improve over time. Base Notes is a perfumers forum that has lots of info and helpful. I’m sure there are talented folks here too that might chime in.

Loved it.