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20 minutes ago, Noob82 said:

If you order the same type of wax do you retest every recipe with your new batch?  Like if I established a 735 with thos FO in 6006 and my batch of 6006 runs out and I order more. Do you think it's necessary to test every batch?

Yes if the lot number changed.  I have 2 different lots of 6006. When I tested both lots unscented side by side, the newer lot melted a lot quicker. So the wick (htp83) I used in my original 6006 lot was too big / hot for the new lot.  

I haven't tested the new lot yet so I'm not even sure if would be the same wick series either.

Not so much vinegar... but growing up in the late 70's early 80's, my friend and I would help his father make wine.  We're Portuguese, so what else were we supposed to do... Ha! 

We would crush the grapes in this barrel setup he had, add sugar to the grape juice... and after some time... I can't recall if it was weeks or months, we / he would then have wine.  My friend and I were in our early teens at this point.

But moreso, we would take all the crushed peels and seeds and his father would make moonshine (aguardente) with it.  That took what seemed like forever.  He had this still in this adjoining locked room in the basement.  It was like watching an episode of M*A*S*H or The Dukes of Hazzard... curled copper lines / piping that would literally just drip this clear liquid into a bottle.  I think he added sugar as well to that to ferment.   

Ahh... the good ol' days.  

You can pick up at CandleChem. That's where I get my wax from. 

Kinda. They burn a tad cooler than the regular CD. There are some older posts where it states that the CDN's are like an in-between. I think it was Talltayl that mentioned a CDN8 would be like a CD7 so to speak. 

They have a coating on them that helps burn with the acidity in wax.

I just looked and I purchased mine from Southwest as well as Northstar for the smaller sizes. However, I checked online and it looks like candle cocoon sells the smaller and larger sizes. 

As far as Premier, I tested with the 735 and 745. I don't have a 740 but I think that would have worked for what I have. 

Edited to add to try a couple of different sizes in CDN...6,7,8 etc. 

I will double check when I get home, but I believe it was from Southwest Candle.  With that being said, I had to purchase CDN7's and lower from a different supplier.  

As far as soot... none would be optimal.  I think what is acceptable comes down to what is acceptable to you.  I shoot for no soot.  If it's at the end of the container and there's a little here and there, there might be a little wiggle room.  I would probably try a different wick series to rule it out.  Premier is a good option as Talltayl had mentioned. 

It also depends on your FO.  

The CD5 may work.  Unfortunately, you would have to test.  

With the 12 oz. Mason Jar and the 9 oz straight-sided jar, I'm having good results with CDN8. Both of those are the same diameter as the 8 oz mason jars that I have as well.  I originally used HTP 83 but the flame was dimming out. The CDN8 was a better choice for me. 

With the batch of 6006 I had / still have from 2020, in the same size vessel, with three different FO's, I ended up using HTP, CDN and Premier.  

Those look awesome!

1 hour ago, Belinda said:

I keep saying I'm going to do that too but every time a suppliers comes out with new scents I feel like I just have to try them! Then I go right back to using what I like LOL! 

If you haven't tried Midwest Fragrance Co. they have some really good oils, great customer service and they're expanding all the time. 

Haha! Yup!

I actually have a few oils from Midwest. Haven't tested quite yet. I'm in the same boat as you 😁

14 minutes ago, Belinda said:

To be honest, like most of us on here, I just have WAY TOO MANY TO BEGIN WITH!!! LOL!

Ha! I hear you on that one! I have way too many and trying to narrow down at this point which ones I want to play with. 

1 hour ago, TallTayl said:

5x and 5 fold are the same, yes.  
lemon can be more fugitive than other citrus. A blend with may chang/litsea cubeba helps give it staying power in soap. Full disclosure, I swapped to lemon verbena by AromaHaven/rustic Escentuals the last time lemon EO prices got crazy.  I’ve not used lemon EO in soap for years since I loved the lemon verbena.  The same lemon verbena FO works remarkably well in all of my candle waxes too, so win. 
 

if you’re looking at citrus oils (specifically oranges) , hurricane Ian damage is going to have a ripple effect soon. 

Good to know! 

And yes, good point regarding Ian. 

Thank you!

20 minutes ago, TallTayl said:

Quite a few EO last very well in soap.  In my process (CP) and formula lavender 40/42 lasts for at least a year. Once cured I package in glassine bags. 
 

orange 5x, 10x

lemon 5x

 

Could it be that many who have not experienced longevity with EO are not getting great quality EO? 

the list of FO that do NOT last as long is much longer. 🙄

That quite possibly could be the case 🙂 .  I just looked up lemon 5x.  Is that the one from Lebermuth or is 5x also considered "5 fold"?  A quick search of 5x brought me to a couple of different results.  

@TallTayl I just double checked the usage rate and realized that I purchased the 40/42 from WSP and not CC.  Anyway...  Does the scent last in CP soap?  I haven't tried EO in soap but have been reading where EO's don't last that long as FO in soap?  Is 40/42 the exception to this rule in your experience?  I'd rather try it in CP than testing for a wick in a candle.... I think. 🤔

14 minutes ago, TallTayl said:

I wish ALL retailers would include lot numbers so at least we have a heads up to retest as needed. 
 

I seem to get the most consistency over time with retail brands like crafters choice. Rustic escentuals/aroma haven have been pretty consistent over the years, though I have not purchased much of anything from these places in he past year, so fingers crossed it is still true. 

That would be too easy don't you think?  They include lot #'s on wax so why can't / won't they slap a lot # on the bottle label?  I would assume that the drums, or whatever size they receive them in, has a manufactured date etc.  

I actually purchased a 4oz bottle of lavender 40/42 from crafters choice a couple of weeks ago.  I read about it in another thread where you mentioned it.  For the price I paid for it I'm almost unsure what application to use it in.  It's only 4oz.  

I'm just thinking about it now and forgot to mention...

I have a sample from Aztec, Georgia Peach, from possibly end of last year/beginning of this year.

I then ordered 2 more samples of the same oil when they had their sale in July/August.

I compared the oils and they smell different oob. The newest samples smelled peachy while the older sample did not. I don't recall if the original sample smelled peachy to begin with.

Could the oil be bad? Different manufactured date and batch?  Maybe it will smell the same like the new samples when burned?

I realize this is part of the game not having 100% control of manufacturing and being dependent on others. 

Oh the challenges 🤪

Thank you @Belinda 

Meaning, if I receive a 1oz sample today that I like and order a 16oz bottle of it a year from now... will it be the same oil / recipe as the sample and will burn the same as the sample did a year prior? 

Noting that nothing else will change on my end… same package of wicks, same lot of wax, vessel etc. 

I have plenty of samples as well as larger bottles from different suppliers that are working for me.  I would like to order more of what I currently have but also trying to avoid starting from scratch / tweaking because of FO reformulations and the lack of communication to their customers. 

Or is it more of an issue with the manufacturers of the oils making changes and not letting the supplier know about a slight recipe change with the lot / batch?  I would assume once they have something down that they would continue to produce the same product to the milligram.  Am I asking for too much?

Off the top of my head, I have samples and larger bottles from AFI, Aztec, Candle Cocoon, Candle Science, Fragrance Buddy, Midwest, Nature's Garden and possibly a couple of others.  

So… who are your fav’s and go-to and never a letdown?     

I too am trying 2 different lots of 4627.  One from last Spring / Summer (2021) and one from this Spring / Summer. 

Right off the bat there is a noticeable difference in appearance and feel.

I should mention that I only used the batch from last year to play with blending so I don’t really have anything to gauge as far as how 4627 “used to be / should be”. 

So with that being said... I then made a couple of 4627 candles with Frosted Juniper from CS @ 6% in 9oz straight sided jars and burned after 7 days or so of curing.  I did not get that “in your face” like everyone mentions.  Which is why I’m now comparing these 2 different lots.  I tried LX 12, 14, 16 and HTP 83 and going to try HTP 73 for the fun of it.

Anyway… here goes..

The old batch from last year has that Vaseline look and feel to it… sticky, messy etc.

The new batch from this year is more like Crisco… white, harder and less sticky.  I literally scooped it out with gloves with not much sticking to the gloves. 

I made 4 testers… 2 scented and 2 unscented. 

1 old batch unscented

1 new batch unscented

1 old batch with Mac Apple from CS @ 6%.

1 new batch with Mac Apple from CS @ 6%.

Using 9oz straight sided jars.  7 ounces of wax for each jar. 

Double boiler method.  Melting it down there was a noticeable difference as well. 

The old batch was fully melted with no intervention (stirring) at 196F.

The new batch was fully melted also with no intervention (stirring) at 206F.

Both batches I let sit for about 2 minutes or so around 195F.

I used a digital thermometer with probe for the temps.  Compared with another thermometer for accuracy and got the same readings.

Added FO at 188F for both batches.

I poured the old batch at around 165F.

The new batch at 165F was clouding up and some residue was left in the pouring pot.  I then warmed it back up to around 175 to melt the remaining wax inside the pot.  I poured this one around 167ish. 

I’m going to wait 5 days or so before I test burn them unless others recommend less or more days.

I’ll report my finding after that.  Hopefully both batches work well and give that super strong throw and maybe the Frosted Juniper that I used just wasn’t working in this wax.  

A boy can dream… right?

We have used 494 in the past without any issue. We poured into clamshells.  Have not tried 416. 

Thanks for the heads up.  My wife uses the Coconut Lime Verbana in her soaps.  Not anymore from the looks of it.  Time to gobble up what's left. 

20 minutes ago, BenderSF said:

Yeah, I just finished a rebottling project for my aging FO stash.  I moved anything that was in HDPE bottles, which tend to collapse (and stink) into PET bottles.  I started with glass but I have too many oils and glass gets really heavy really quickly, so I went with PET for most of them.

 

My oldest oils had been sitting in HDPE bottles for 3.5 years.  I assume they must have lost some strength during that time.  I put a couple in wax recently and it wasn't really noticeable but I feel better knowing they're in PET bottles now.  And my closet stinks slightly less now.  😆

I had to look up HDPE and PET bottles. It's the HDPE that I have that are collapsing. Time to make the move I guess. I was wondering at what point does the oil seep into the plastic or plastic break down into the oil. 🤔

1 hour ago, Belinda said:

I've had several bottles collapse like you're talking about but I've had it do that with clear bottles and also white ones. So far none of the round bullet bottles have done it. I'm not sure what causes that. Some even crack at the sides after it collapses.

If you mean the round bullet like the CS ones, yup, I've noticed that too. Some of them slightly sucked in but not like the other types of bottles I have. I haven't noticed cracks yet though. Something to look out for. 😬

3 hours ago, KrisS said:

If it's something that matters, I move it into amber glass.  If I don't care if it goes rancid, it can stay in floppy plastic indefinitely.

I hear ya. In my case though, I haven't even tried a lot of these. So... yeah... I should probably get on that 😁. 

4 hours ago, kandlekrazy said:

It really depends on both the type of plastic and the fo itself.  I found heavy vanilla and sometimes citrus will cause the bottles to cave in at which time I would switch them to glass.  99% of the time the oils remain in the same bottle purchased in.  Once I had about 10 bottles purchased at the same time from a supplier where the bottles started to morph and I changed them all out but that happened once in 30+ years.  I think that was a batch of fo where the supplier changed their bottles only to find they didn't work out.

Thanks. I have a few of them where the bottles are collapsing / caving in. Those are  (for lack of better words) the clear/smoked looking bottles. 

So.... I have some oils that are getting close to 2 years old sitting in the original plastic bottles that they came in...  CS, NG, Aztec, Midwest and a couple others.  

At what point should I move / should have moved them into glass bottles?  I assume the type of plastic these bottles are made of will make a difference as well.