Clear Black

Im beginning the journey of taking my longtime hobby into the business phase of things. For all of you seasoned business folks here, what do I need to do in order to get started and be legal? I know I need product liability insurance for starters. I am the only one making/selling the candles currently, so do I make my business an LLC, Inc, etc etc? I also will be launching a website to sell online, what do I need for that in regards to taxes and all that. Do I need to apply for a tax ID number from the IRS or what is it.

I read through TT's sticky in the business section, but it mostly just covered insurance. Im sure there are other things I need to do in order to run a business other than insurance. 

Thanks for any information!

On 12/2/2022 at 10:02 PM, Ernie said:

Ok got bored today so i figured out what seems to be the 1286 mottling formula using multi purpose wax for anyone interested. 6.25% stearic per pound of wax. Lol so simple. First pic is all the testers I made to get the finish result which is teal colored one that still isnt finished mottling yet. 

How did these perform during testing? Was this 1230 wax + 6.25% stearic? If so, was there any seapage of FO?

17 hours ago, TallTayl said:

I’m not sure what the reaction would be with that wax. The % testing may have been when retail Fragrance oils were not filled with so much diluent 🤷🏻‍♀️

 

I did a few tests with up to 50% : 50% stearic with various liquid oils with lots of success. Was surprised. 
 

the stearic May or may not cause setting up issues with your wax. 

I tested 3% Stearic per pound of wax last night. At 5% FO the stearic eliminated the sweating 100%, but it also eliminated the mottling 100% 😂

I will try 2% stearic tonight and wrap the jar in foil, try and slow the cool more

On 12/9/2022 at 1:56 PM, TallTayl said:

I'm so happy you found a great solution! Stearic acid isn't going anywhere, so you're SET!

Does stearic provide the same reduction in fragrance sweating that the vybar 343 did? I have a mottling wax I have been trying to get to work, which says it can hold 6% fo. I am down to 3% fo and it is still sweating out the fo. Im about to give up and look for another mottling wax. The current wax Im using is the 1286 from Aztec. Im really sad it cannot hold FO even at 4%, trying 3% tonight but the 4% tester was rather weak on Cold throw.

On 8/14/2022 at 7:42 AM, PINKT said:

I'll get it at Candles &Supplies.. I made a tester last Sept. with 6% fragrance and just lit it yesterday. Oh wow! I used 3 Aroma Lite 80 wicks because the jar is 4in and the hot throw and burn were magnificent!  I remember testing the 6098 last year and getting a lot of soot from wicks- I'm guessing I didn't let it cure long enough. What wicks do you like in the 6098?

 

Are you still using this wax? If so, what are your thoughts? Just received a test slab and making my first tester now. Im going 70/30 6098/444 just to bump the soy content up a bit. Id like to know the actual soy content of 6098, but cannot find that info anywhere.

28 minutes ago, TallTayl said:

Yankee, Kringle, etc don’t seem to be suffering 🤷🏻‍♀️
I think many of the in-person markets and festivals draw “that type” of customer. It’s frustrating knowing a crappily made soy candle will sell but a much nicer paraffin/palm/etc will be snubbed. They are not our market.

Ya, that is what I have been thinking all along. If Yankee, Kringle, Village sell boat loads of paraffin still then it must be ok. I just have to realize that "those people" are those people lol

Just got done with a summer music festival and did great for the weekend. However, I am noticing more and more customers just outright bashing paraffin candles with wild claims of how toxic they are. Currently my candles are soy/coconut, but when trying to defend paraffin they tend to look puzzled as to why I am not bad mouthing paraffin wax along side them. I then go on to try to explain that no matter what wax, as long as it is properly tested and wicked it will be just fine. But they do not want to hear it and have their mind set. I usually end the sale with them saying something like "Thank god your candles are soy, or else I would not be buying it"

So..do any of you currently sell all paraffin candles? And if so, do you have to "convince" people that your candle is perfectly safe etc etc?

Sorry for the late reply, but I did test these at one point and found the bigger issue besides heat, was rust. I tested cans from different sources and tested with a variety of fo's. What I found was that they tend to rust very easily and I just couldnt live with knowing that. You may have better luck with whomever you sourced yours from, but I moved on and just stuck with the tin cans most suppliers sell.

Looks great! What wax are you using that you need a double wick in that container might I ask?

On 11/1/2020 at 9:03 AM, TallTayl said:

With regard to full melt pool, that is a limit and not a goal. I’m not sure who started this phenomenon that you have to have a full melt pool early in the candle.

If you watch any of the candle reviewers on you tube, basically its them telling everyone that a FMP needs to happen ASAP. They give bad reviews if it doesnt "pool out" immediatly. There are many, many candle reviews with hundreds of thousands of watchers, who then go and tell their facebook groups and friends and so on...its REALLY unsafe to have a FMP so early on, but thats what these reviewers are telling the masses. I will continue to make a safe candle vs a quick burning one tyvm

On 11/10/2020 at 9:26 PM, ErronB said:

 

I'm not Moon, but I did test them again in Northwood's own coconut wax that they use for a fair test. They did burn well, nice power behind the flame to get a decent melt pool but the hot throw was very mediocre. And they don't self-trim properly, so if you're into making super clean burning candles then they won't be any use to you. You can still get a good 3 or so burns out of them before they start breaking down though.

Ty!

On 11/11/2020 at 11:43 AM, moonshine said:

Well....I am still going up in sizes to see if the throw improves, so far not much  - the flame is beautiful in coconut blends and no carbon or soot  - reviews are consistent that the wicking chart is way off and you need to go way up in size 

They remind me of LX with a thicker coating, being so new with only 1 supplier I’m not totally trusting yet - but I do have to give them kudos for the marketing strategy to get the sample pack - with the many supply changes, people including myself, were hot to jump on it hoping for the miracle cure in coconut 

I will post an update to see if I accomplish decent throw and maintain the nice burn 

 

Depending on your blend they may work for you - they have not been dirty at all as far as  throwing soot, and the flame stays pretty low like an aromalite wick 

I’m curious how these would perform in paraffin but I don’t use paraffin to find out 🤷‍♀️

Thanks. I plan on testing some of the coco-apricot wax blwnds ive been reading about and will maybe get the sample pack to try

On 10/15/2020 at 9:47 AM, moonshine said:

Here you go

 
calypso is a 42 in coconut container slab from candles and supplies with additional soy added 

 

mason jar is a 39 with coconut container slab by itself 

Any updates on these wicks Moon? I need a shorter/fatter wick for my blend, currently every wick I try in my blend has a straight/tall flame and it starts to throw soot at the slightest flicker

2 minutes ago, TallTayl said:

Bent, like folded over itself, or bent like leaning in the softened remaining wax so the curl is now touching?

 

The wick is a zinc core, so the wick itself is standing upright its just the flame that is bent over itself. It does the same thing on the Kringle 2 wick with their wicks also which are not zinc core, more like Premiers.  Ive tested the both candles in the middle of the house, and in a small bathroom with door closed and its the same either way, flame is just bent over and scorches the wax. Bummer

Jar: 31 ounce Libbey cylinder. 5.5" tall by 4" wide. Double wicked. The wax is about half-way down burned now, and the flame instead of standing upright, is now just bent over. Its bent over so much that it is now touching the wax pool and causing discoloration from the burnt wax. I also have a 2 wick Kringle jar in their "status" style which is almost the same dimensions as listed above. I am also at the half-way point in the burn and the flames ALSO bend over in that jar. 

Everything else is working fine, throw is fantastic, but the candle just turns discolored and looks like turd.  I am starting to think I have a drafty house? My house is old and most definitely has drafts, but could these drafts be the cause of this issue, or is this issue because my container is too tall and this is just the natural air flow after the mid-way point of any jar this tall?

Any insights would be helpful and if anyone of you folks have also experienced this what did you do differently. Thanks. 

1 hour ago, Candybee said:

 

I have 3 grahics I downloaded and want to make changes to them to make them my own. They are all silhouette vector images. Besides making the changes I want them all to be transparencies so when I copy them onto my labels, promotional materials, etc., they show up as transparent with only the image on the page. Do you know how to do this?

That depends really on what the changes are. To make any changes to the vector graphic itself you would need the original .ai file, and even then any design changes may be more than what  I am capable of doing. I am teaching myself bit by bit

Can you maybe link a .jpg image of the vector graphic and explain what changes you would like? 

And as far as being transparent, if there is access to the .ai file, all that needs to be done is to set the background as transparent

Hope this helps, but probably not lol

On 8/30/2020 at 1:42 PM, Candybee said:

I have a specific logo in mind. A silhouette thats black and white.

 

Can you share any more information Candy? Thats a bit vague tbh, but I am always working in Adobe Illustrator so I might be able to help. I am no graphic artist though, I just make my own labels instead of hiring someone

3 hours ago, TallTayl said:

Once the top crust is thick enough to hold back the cooling wax I take off the wick holders and do the flip. It takes a little bit to learn the right time so that you don’t have a gush of molten wax everywhere. When the crust is thick enough that wick is not going anywhere.
 

It does work and is certainly easier than poking and refilling! It looks a lot nicer too.

Awesome! Something new to try and learn, I love it  

41 minutes ago, TallTayl said:

That is a monster size jar! Good luck! 
 

the status jar is a nice one to cut your teeth on. I pick them up at local dollar store to have on hand for fun projects like this. 
 

you will love shutting the door on soy. ❤️
 

when making these, remember that there will always be a big trapped air bubble once the top seals over. Many people have great luck flipping the jar over when the top crust is thick enough to force the bubble to what will be the bottom of the finished candle. 

I have heard this mentioned before...does this actually work? And yes, my first tester indeed had a cavity just below the surface which I poked at and then refilled with the leftover wax. How does the "flip" work with having my wick retainers in place? Is it ok by this point to remove the retainer and do the flip? Hmm

The 31 oz Libbey cylinder is indeed a massive jar. I really love the 2-wick status type jar that Kringle offers, the one with the nice big label ya know. So Im using that as an inspiration for a tall multi-wick jar that is also straight sided and that 31 cylinder seems like a good fit.  

You can get the Libbey Cylinder jars at your local Michaels craft stores btw, which is awesome for just picking a few up at a time for testers  

3 hours ago, TallTayl said:

In a word, yes. 
 

Pros:

palm candles, when made well, can easily outperform soy in many ways.  Notably, after about a week of cure time they pretty much stay stable, so your wick is your wick. 
 

very shippable during any weather. Palm wax is either solid or liquid.  There is no in between that can melt into sludge in a hot delivery truck. 

palm can burn spic and span sootless  when well made.

 

Palm wax seems much less prone to issues during  high humidity. 
 

every lot of palm wax I have received and used has performed practically identically to the prior lot.
 

they hold less FO (3-6% max depending on the blend is typical) but HT is better with less FO. I tell this tea lite story so often, but forgive me... a tea lite I made scented at 3% of a lilac Burning in my kitchen once overtook my entire house So powerfully that I had to open windows in a Chicago January to air it out. 
 

the scent throw tends to be more “pure” and less wax. You know how most candle waxes have that undertone of burning wax? Palm tends to not. 

 

in a glass container, the glow of palm is mesmerizing. 
 

frost is a feature not a detriment!!!! you WANT frost, so cool slowly. 
 

you need to pour hot, so less time spent waiting for it to be ready to pour. Heat to 200*F, add color and FO. stir and pour as hot as you can. 
 

palm colors beautifully. A tiny amount of liquid color makes clean colors, not pastels like more opaque soy.

 

palm can be an excellent amendment to some soy waxes to improve less desirable tendencies of both. C1, for example, contains 20% of a palm wax.  Not sure which one. 
 

Pro  and con:

container type is important. Palm likes to burn down then out, so your container should be taller than it is wide. Palm wax is terrible in tins for this reason. I would have gone palm long ago if my main brand didn’t rely on tins. 
 

Cons:

 

over Wicking and overscenting can be disastrous.  both of My near house fires were caused by and over wicked palm candles. The first One was wood wicked in a square libbey jar. The flame got too tall and hot and set the Libbey jar on fire shooting glass across my living room.
 

The other was a 16 oz jelly jar that was over scented, over colored and over wicked. it leaked colored FO upon arrival.  I had to sit with the candle nearby within eyesight and trim the wick every 15 minutes to keep it tamed. The jar was still totally black by the end. 

in my experience and opinion, palm burns more quickly than a similarly sized container of soy. 
 

people don’t really know what the wax is so you’ll need to market to them differently about the benefits. 
 

it is harder to clean pour pots and tools. A griddle or heat gun helps. 

CT Can seem less powerful than soy or paraffin, but it is there. When kept sealed, the containers can hold their own for customers who desire a nice CT. that said, @moonshine made a feather palm pillar candle of my Sweet Amber for me. I could smell wafts of it for many months throughout my living room. Made me super happy to smell my favorite scent of all time when in my favorite chair. 
 

popular blends, like glass glow, can go out of stock for months at a time, especially during the Winter holiday season.

 

wicks that work well in palm are less abundant. CSN are my favorite, but are only through Candlescience in small quantities. a couple of in between sizes are not readily available through candle science, they need to be ordered special from distributors.

square braid can work.

rrd “can work” though I have not found them to be great in my tests.

 

it is difficult to do wickectomy es to swap out wicks when learning the wax. You need to excavate with sharp tools to remove then replace a new test wick. 
 

I encourage you to try an easy to get palm wax just for the experience.  Palm wax is like no other, so treat it as such. Don’t try to make it burn like a soy candle. Forget everything you have ever learned about soy when working with palm.
 

Let a bit of hang up form as that is the glow as it burns deeper into the jar. The glow catches up as it burns. they are like little stained glass windows.

Wow, such a thoughtful and intelligent response. Many thanks TT. 

For starters, I believe I went well over the FO% I should have at 8%. The next one I will for sure drop to at or below 6% and see how that is. At 8% the CT was amazing, stronger than most soy blends I have been using. 

As for reference, my "endgame" will be the 31 oz. Libbey Cylinder Jar, so it will indeed be taller than wider. I will either double wick, or if need be it can be triple wicked. Although once you start going 3 wicks in this jar you have to be pretty darn sure about not over wicking as it is a tallish jar.

I purchased a 10lb bag of the Glass glow from Lonestar to blend with some J-223, which makes a great HT but on the weakish side for CT. While working with the palm I found it to be very easy to use in the granule form and started messing around with a straight palm in tiny testers. So far its a very different experience but one I would like to look into further.  The 31 oz Libbey holds about 27 oz of finished product, so I want to test some more smaller ones before I start wasting product in those bigger jars.

Thanks for all the tips and assurance that palm is worth looking into. Ive said this before and will say again, I am about at the point where I want to stop selling soy altogether and just forget it exists lol. Ive spent the better part of a year trying to move on from soy and the last of my stock is about sold, so time to maybe reformulate with something that does not vary as much batch to batch. 

Ive been making candles for many years now and have never considered palm candles to be a "contender" in the market compared to either Paraffin or Soy.  So my question is, do palm container candles have the ability to compete, meaning...do they have a good enough scent throw and are they able to hold scent like Soy or Paraffin. I only ask this because I am confused as to how palm does with fragrance, whether it be hot or cold throw. Some distributors claim max fragrance load is 3%, another claims it is 9.5%. (This is in reference to IGI R2322A GLASS GLOW PALM CONTAINER WAX)  So I am not sure who to trust as I have never made any palm candles until last night. I made one with 8% FO and the FO VERY slightly seeped out, but after resting overnight those seepage's were no longer there. I can always lower the FO % no problem so I am not worried there. 

Basically, what I am after is does Palm container candles "hold up" against their more popular counterparts in regards to hot/cold throw?

Cheers all

Not exactly sure what caused all this..but a 24hr cure on 464 is no where near long enough for the wax to be fully hardened. The golden rule of thumb for this type soy wax is a MINIMUM of  2 weeks for a cure, then start your testing. If you want to, make two testers and burn one at the 1-week mark, the other at the 2-week mark. 

Recently I have been toying with the idea of making a specific line of wick-less/flame-less candles. Im curious as to what is all of your opinions on using hot plate type warmers vs a wick and flame.  I personally prefer to use my hot plate and avoid the flame all together, mostly to avoid any sooting from store bought candles and secondly as a safety precaution around my cats who like to jump up on the table and get curious. 

I guess what Id like to know is, do any of you folks sell wick-less versions of your jars or make a specific wick-less candle?  Do you personally like using a hot plate? Would you purchase a wick-less candle in store knowing it isnt a traditional  wick burning jar? Lastly, is there a market or is there buyers actually looking for a wick-less version of candles for either safety or health (cleaner burning) reasons?

Any input would be great, I am on the fence about even starting to pursue this new line of thinking. Time will tell I guess 😛 

1 hour ago, xxxAlpha71xxx said:

I know this is an old post  but I ran across this last weekend.  We have a little indoor antique and craft market where 100+ vendors have various booths.  We went looking this past weekend to see what people were selling candles for and how they looked/smelled.  There were several vendors selling candles, soap, and the like but all from national names everyone knows.  We ran across one booth that was entirely candles, soap, melts, etc.  You would swear just looking at it that everything in it was locally produced.  The company that houses the vendors take care of all sales and the vendors are not actually on site so there's no one for you to speak with.  We bought one of the candles just to see how the local competition was doing in the event that we actually move forward with a long term goal of setting up a little business of our own. 

 

Just this morning I actually started looking at the lid and there in little tiny letters was a website.  I said cool, let's check out their website.  Not a local craftsman at all but a chain that I'd never heard of based in one of the Northern states.

 

Not really a lie per se but the booth was definitely set up to be a tad misleading.  I won't mention any names but the name of the company was even such that you would think that it was a small local operation.

A lot of that falls on the folks hosting said event too. If they market that event as crafts made by local artisans then thats what should be there. If they then allow companies from far away to fill empty booth slots, then they should at least make an effort to say otherwise

50 minutes ago, NightLight said:

Etsy LOVES cats. So I would create spiel about being a cat and animal lover. Are your candles vegan, you can spin that there too.

you need a burn shot somewhere Maine - like, if you want to emphasize that. Also maybe a shot of your daughter smelling fragrances, and story why she likes certain ones.

Create a discount code in your store. 

Working on burn shots as I type this. I found a 100 year old piece of wood in the rafters of my garage, so I am refinishing it little by little. I will use that as a prop base to take some good photos on if it comes out the way I want it. 

EDIT: Also, Im not entirely sure if they are vegan or not nor have I ever understood the benefits of calling it that. A clean burning candle, whether vegan or not, is my main goal.