Dye and soy

[Holly]

Hi Everyone,

From all the testing I have been doing it appears that when I have to use more liquid dye to produce a deeper shade it frosts more than when I make candles with a light shade. I was wondering if it is true that the more dye used the more frosting can appear. It seems to be the case so far, but I am not absolutely postitive. I never go over the recommended amount. Most of the time I don't need to go over 10 drops total (different colors together to get a specific tone). It seems like the candles that only need 1-3 or maybe 4 drops always come out looking the best. Several of my scents only reguire 1-2 drops.

I don't mind some frosting and can embrace it, but there are times when it is more than I would like -- actually what I think a customer would like. I have heard from many on here that customers do not seem to mind. But, I do not have anything to compare them with -- how much frosting, etc.?

Do most of you who make soy candles just keep the shades lighter than you would paraffin? I know that even the darker shades in soy are always going to be lighter than the dark shades in paraffin. For example, Blackberry Tea, I would normally make this a deep shade. Would you just keep it a lighter shade? I guess my dilemma is --> deep colors when needed with more frosting or lighter shades with less frosting. I guess that since I do not sell yet, it is hard to say what the customers would prefer in my neck of the woods, and I am not sure even what I prefer at this point. lol I guess I could go either way for me.

I assume that when I do start to sell, I will find these things out. I have a friend that loves deep colors. I am suppose to bring her some candles on Wednesday. I will ask what she prefers. That would be a start.

I look forward to any input. Thanks!

~Holly

[Vicky_CO]

It is true the more dye you use the greater chances of frosting. My customer don't mind a little bit of frosting. I personaly think the FO cause more frosting than dye ever would.

[Holly]

That is why I am not absolutely positive it is the amount of dye and that it could be the different oils. I guess the only way to tell would be to make 1 candle with the same FO, same amount of FO, DARK color, pour at the same temp and then make one with the same FO, same amount of FO, LIGHT color, same pour temp and see what happens. Sometimes, the difference in room temps can make a difference and how the room temps fluctuate. However, I sometimes make a batch of candles at the same time with some light ones and some darker ones and the lighter ones always seem to come out the best.

Thanks again.

[siberia]

I use liquid dye in my paraffin and palm candles but switch to powder dyes when it comes to soy. On Nature's Gift site there is a page that talks about the various dyes and their affects on soy. Using CB Tips. It's about half-way down the page.

[Holly]

I remember reading on the old board that some do recommend powder dye for soy but then a lot also use the liquid. I buy the liquid dye from a place that sells the non-smelling type and is suppose to be good with soy. I will read the info you posted and I may give the powdered dye a try with the soy. I just made a Blueberry Verbena candle with a little less dye this time (total of 5 drops which was less than the last one I made) and it still frosted more than a lot of my other candles with a different color, different FO and amount of dye. Maybe not quite as bad. They are faint frost lines from the top to the bottom of the candle -- too consistent. I can accept it because of how many positive benefits this soy wax has to offer, but I hope it will not bug the customers. It is not ugly, but just looks like an imperfection. It could be the fragrance on this one. I will test some more and see if using only two drops with the same oil produces the same amount of frost lines.

Thanks again for the info. I will check it out.

~Holly

[Henryk]

I was basically going to say the same thing. The solvents in the dyes, if something has a tendency to frost, could make it worse. I just bought a pile of dye chips in many shades from a couple places (including some that are soy based) to test. I don't like blending liquid dyes, but do have and use them. The other thing, if you have a dark color soy candle, naturally you are going to notice the frost more than in a light color.

You may want to try Ecosoya's advanced blend (new version). I can get much deeper colors than I could with regular soy (plus its 100% soy) - and its frosts very little if at all. If you find a bit of frost on the top - which is the almost the only place I've ever seen real frost in this soy, you can add a very very small amount of BW but I don't think its necessary - you can also heat gun it. The other thing is to try a paraffin/soy blend if you don't mind the paraffin - that will also allow you to get much deeper colors without frosting. When I used the soy/paraffin blend I NEVER got ANY frosting - your wicking does change drastically though.

I've not used the powder dyes because you may have to blend it seperately in melted stearic before you add to it to your soy. And again, there's the blending thing since they only come in so many shades from what I see.

[Holly]

I did test the EcoSoya 120 that I have had for awhile here as just a soy to add to other waxes. It did not hardly frost at all. However, I like the cold and hot throw better with the CB-3 (Calsoy). I have not tried the Eco Soya 135 or the Advanced yet. I really do love the CB-3 (Calsoy). It has a really good cold and hot throw, is easy to wick, and I can get it in my state! I just want to get the best procedures down so I can make the best of this wax cosmetic wise.

I will someday try the Eco 135 and the new advanced just to see the difference. The fact that I can order the CB-3 Calsoy in my state is a good thing. Everything else I get comes from further away and the shipping eats me alive -- especially glass!

Thanks again for your input. You have given the board a lot of helpful information.

~Holly

[smiley_miley]

I don't know if you have tried this yet, but since soy wax is so light, a lot of people recommend adding some black dye with your color to deepen it, so you don't have to use so much dye. It works for me, that is what I do.

[foxhill]

I had black or blue to dye to get a darker color. I have used blocks, powderes, chips and liquids in soy and prefer liquids for getting darker colors. As for the frosting on the candles I had one wholesale customer tell me she liked it because it made the candles look more "handmade" and not mass produced. I only have a very few that I get frosting on so I don't worry too much about it.