My first blend of any wax. 464 and 4625

[Trappeur]

Tall Tayle, thankyou for spending so much time explaining about this situation as you sure have put a lot of time into this.

 

So much of this is soooo greek to me I have to keep reading your posts over and over and try to decipher what you are saying....lol  You really know your stuff...

 

Trappeur

[Faerywren]

Trappeur,  my blend for tarts is 50/50 464 and 4625. My blend for containers is 50/50 464 and 4630. I had so many issues testing 100% soy. I work full time and, frankly, didn't have the time it was taking to fiddle with those issues to make a candle I was happy with. Adding the paraffin helped tremendously with achieving consistent, shorter curing, good throwing, nice looking candles. 

[Trappeur]

 Hi  Faerywren

 

Thankyou so much for the info.  I sure do appreciate it.  Moonstar suggested to me the exact combo's you said.  

 

I will in fact try exactly as you said.  Matter of fact I ordered a 20.00 slab of 4625 I received 2 days ago....Damn, is that hard wax!   I have never ordered any paraffin b/4.   

This will be a first for me!  So what do you do?   Melt some of the 4625 and then pour into a pour pot the amount I need and then add the soy to it?

 

Trappeur

[moonshine]

Blending waxes I measure it out first before melting 

if your doing a pound batch measure 8 ounces of 464 and 8 ounces of 4625 and then melt it together then add FO and pour at your pour temp 

4625 I put in a garbage bag and slam it on concrete several times to break it up then put it in a container - for smaller pieces to get your measurements exact usually a screwdriver and hammer will chisel some away....it's the hardest wax I have ever seen 😂

 

[Sarah S]

I do it like Moonshine does, measure, mix, melt. It can be kind of a PITA, but I love being able to tinker with my blends to get the exact results I want.

Of course, I'm sure with the volume of candles you make, you probably won't want to be making changes batch to batch, but I think you will be really pleased with your new Soy Blend candles!

oh yeah, and I don't bother with the garbage bag, I go straight to the chisel. 😆

[Faerywren]

4625 is very hard. I've done the garbage bag and drop method and the screwdriver and hammer method to break the wax up. Like others have mentioned, I measure my wax into the melter 50% 464 and 50% 4625 (or 4630), then stir it well with a whisk before dispensing into my pour pot. It's just part of my process now, so I don't register it as quite such a pain. 

[Moonstar]

1 hour ago, Sarah S said:

I do it like Moonshine does, measure, mix, melt. It can be kind of a PITA, but I love being able to tinker with my blends to get the exact results I want.

Of course, I'm sure with the volume of candles you make, you probably won't want to be making changes batch to batch, but I think you will be really pleased with your new Soy Blend candles!

oh yeah, and I don't bother with the garbage bag, I go straight to the chisel. 😆

The chisel ???? Always staying on your good side 

[Moonstar]

19 hours ago, moonshine said:

Blending waxes I measure it out first before melting 

if your doing a pound batch measure 8 ounces of 464 and 8 ounces of 4625 and then melt it together then add FO and pour at your pour temp 

4625 I put in a garbage bag and slam it on concrete several times to break it up then put it in a container - for smaller pieces to get your measurements exact usually a screwdriver and hammer will chisel some away....it's the hardest wax I have ever seen 😂

 

You and @Sarah S with your chisels lol ! Im staying on BOTH of your good sides. Especially you, your less than an hour away from me 

[Trappeur]

35 minutes ago, Moonstar said:

You and @Sarah S with your chisels lol ! Im staying on BOTH of your good sides. Especially you, your less than an hour away from me 

 

Trappeur

[Trappeur]

Geezum crow....you use chisels?  omg.....I have never worked with a paraffin and when I got these "bricks"...I thought, oh my god...how do these people deal with this all the time? 

 

Trappeur

[Nickie]

28 minutes ago, Trappeur said:

Geezum crow....you use chisels?  omg.....I have never worked with a paraffin and when I got these "bricks"...I thought, oh my god...how do these people deal with this all the time? 

 

Trappeur

Trappeur-

 

i have read through all of the posts in this thread....learned lots myself. Since I use almost exclusively all paraffin waxes, I agree with what others have said here that adding a little paraffin might work for you. The 4625 will certainly raise your Melt point. 

 

I am one of the people you mentioned earlier....I've tested nearly every paraffin wax out there. I will say that I have never had great results with 4625 (even tho I'm still testing with it at this time), but I do agree it will help with a Melt point increase.

 

The two higher melt point paraffin waxes I've had good results with are IGI 4794 and 450 from Flaming Candle. The 450 is in pellet form, so NO breaking up harder than rock slabs. Out of the 3 waxes I've mentioned here, I get my strongest results with 450. Flaming Candle does sell this in 2lb bags for testing, which could be cheaper for you than IGI products. It isn't going to take much to raise your Melt point to around 125-128 with these hard waxes. 

 

I would be happy to send you any of the 15  plus paraffin (or any soy) waxes I have for your testing. Just let me know and I would be happy to send you a box!  Believe me, I have more than I can even handle and my testing is coming to an end, finally. 

[Moonstar]

2 hours ago, Trappeur said:

Geezum crow....you use chisels?  omg.....I have never worked with a paraffin and when I got these "bricks"...I thought, oh my god...how do these people deal with this all the time? 

 

Trappeur

[obsessed]

On 10/14/2017 at 6:46 AM, Moonstar said:

I always thought steric acid could hinder scent throw if adding more that a few TBL pp, but you referred to it as palm steric, is that different than steric acid ?

What about Vybar or Universal soy additive, would those work in this instance, if so how much is added ?

I haven't tried it , but Aussie Candle Supplies recommends you can use 10% UA to GW416 to make 'a wonderful tart and votive wax that pops straight out of the mould". Maybe worth a try if you have some kicking around. I read a review on it and they liked it

[countrygal3115]

Sorry I was just reading all this and really needed the laugh when Trapper was so shocked at the chisel comment.  I personally use a very large meat cleaver.  I can break the slabs up right in the box.  If you hold one end of the slab up so it isn't touching the slab underneath, then wack it good with the meat cleaver, it breaks up alot easier.  I used to use the bag and drop but this is so much easier and less time consuming.  Hope that helps. 

 

[countrygal3115]

Faerywren what wick are you using with that combination?  I did a blend of 70/30 464/4630 in a straight sized tumbler using the Autumn leaves from BC at 1 oz pp.  I had the perfect burn with an Eco 14 but absolutely no ht after two or three weeks. 

[shicks]

I hope this is not off subject but I started with c3 then I mixed. 80/20 blend of c3 with ecosoya pillar in order to be able to up fragrance to 10 percent candles did not separate from jar and threw like crazy even a small 4 oz jelly jar filled my downstairs , however the wax had a dark brown ring when dried from the pillar blend  and that amount of fo I tried adding whiteners and it was just not acceptable for me the pillar did not make it throw better at 6 percent just allowed me to add more oil without seeping but the candle was not up to par with appearance for selling in boutiques and salons

 

@Trappeur I have been following what you comment on for sometime as your experience and knowledge are wonderful I know you get good throw at 6 percent I have never been happy with throw on any of the 415 444 464 advance 135 I have for 6 years tested them all I am in a large open concept home and buy candles that are Soy that fill this downstairs main living room but I have to have too much oil and an ugly candle in order to get same throw I have used all the wicks have many bags here even tried a bunch of wood wicks I recently was tempted to do a paraffin blend when I went into vet office and one single small paraffin candle filled room then I went to local liquor store again burning a small paraffin with room filling scent. I am very curious how your tests go and thanks for sharing that here. 

 

I am realizing with c3 a strong oil like brown sugar fig throws like crazy but pink chiffon will never be strong enough so it is down to working with a small amount of oils that are notoriously strong. 

 

I am still trying to find out if c3 has hydrogenated oils as it has not been re blended will it get pulled off market like the ecoysoya brands and reformulated in order to follow the 2018 guidelines or is it not food grade and not in danger I have went through two 50 lb boxes recently that seem the same to me but could be old stock lone star goes through. C3 though as that is always what they reccomed so I doubt it is old stock but I am still trying to find a perfect ratio of wax to oil to wick since 2012.... lol I am like the mad chandler 

 

just ranting I never knew it was so hard and so time consuming so interesting and so expensive  but I am 6 years deep with tons invested and will figure this out by 2018 to finally roll out my boutique line artwork and packaging have been done for some time maybe I need to accept there is no perfect Soy and give up the eco candle for a blend..... I just don't want to give up there are awesome soy candles out there what Re they doing......

 

 

Edited November 6, 2017 by shicks

[shicks]

6 minutes ago, shicks said:

I hope this is not off subject but I started with c3 then I mixed. 80/20 blend of c3 with ecosoya pillar in order to be able to up fragrance to 10 percent candles did not separate from jar and threw like crazy even a small 4 oz jelly jar filled my downstairs , however the wax had a dark brown ring when dried from the pillar blend  and that amount of fo I tried adding whiteners and it was just not acceptable for me the pillar did not make it throw better at 6 percent just allowed me to add more oil without seeping but the candle was not up to par with appearance for selling in boutiques and salons

 

@Trappeur I have been following what you comment on for sometime as your experience and knowledge are wonderful I know you get good throw at 6 percent I have never been happy with throw on any of the 415 444 464 advance 135 I have for 6 years tested them all I am in a large open concept home and buy candles that are Soy that fill this downstairs main living room but I have to have too much oil and an ugly candle in order to get same throw I have used all the wicks have many bags here even tried a bunch of wood wicks I recently was tempted to do a paraffin blend when I went into vet office and one single small paraffin candle filled room then I went to local liquor store again burning a small paraffin with room filling scent. I am very curious how your tests go and thanks for sharing that here. 

 

I am realizing with c3 a strong oil like brown sugar fig throws like crazy but pink chiffon will never be strong enough so it is down to working with a small amount of oils that are notoriously strong. 

 

I am still trying to find out if c3 has hydrogenated oils as it has not been re blended will it get pulled off market like the ecoysoya brands and reformulated in order to follow the 2018 guidelines or is it not food grade and not in danger I have went through two 50 lb boxes recently that seem the same to me but could be old stock lone star goes through. C3 though as that is always what they reccomed so I doubt it is old stock but I am still trying to find a perfect ratio of wax to oil to wick since 2012.... lol I am like the mad chandler 

 

just ranting I never knew it was so hard and so time consuming so interesting and so expensive  but I am 6 years deep with tons invested and will figure this out by 2018 to finally roll out my boutique line artwork and packaging have been done for some time maybe I need to accept there is no perfect Soy and give up the eco candle for a blend..... I just don't want to give up there are awesome soy candles out there what aRe they doing......