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How generous are you with refunds?


TallTayl

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I think starting off, with 0 or little following, 100% refund if not satisfied, can build trust and credibility. 

 

Your probably not going to get an abuser early on. Maybe later you can not give refunds or track repeat refunders to cut them off.

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I'm pretty stingy unless something happened during shipment. I stand by my products and I spend the time testing to make great products so I don't really back down easily.  While bad reviews aren't my favorite, sometimes the review reflects more on the customer than my product actually being bad.  It's opinion and that's really all it is, someone's opinion. I know I can't please 100% of my customers. If I had consistent bad reviews on something, I would probably do something about it. I offer sample sizes on many of my products so people don't feel like they're wasting a lot of money.  I am happy to work with someone on a case by case basis if necessary.

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I'm pretty much like SuzyK - bad reviews are - well, bad, however, I am a true true believer in the customer is NOT always right. After working in retail for years as a teen/young adult, you get to know the nature of people pretty well, so I will always want to get to the bottom of WHY they want a refund. Is it because they just don't like the scent, or is it a legitimate concern, like they noticed a crack in the jar? For me to give a refund, it has to be a legitimate reason, or a real concern. 

 

Now, if it's just that they don't like the scent, or it wasn't what they thought it was, I will offer an exchange but not an outright refund. 

 

9 hours ago, bathaway said:

Your probably not going to get an abuser early on. 

I disagree with this statement. If people know you are new to the business, IMO they will see how far they can push you and see what your business limits are. 

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I can be very leery of a bad review or complaint. I like to ask questions and find out exactly what the problem is. More often than not it is something the customer did or didn't do and not the product. I have no problem with replacing a product or letting them select something else even if it was their fault. I do like to make my customers happy and encourage them to let me know how they feel about something they buy from me. But giving a refund is not something I generally do. It would have to be a very special circumstance. So far I have never given a refund or have been asked for one. Maybe I am just lucky. Don't know. I prefer talking to my customer to find out what the problem is and also to get an idea if its a scam or a real complaint.

Edited by Candybee
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8 minutes ago, Jcandleattic said:

I'm pretty much like SuzyK - bad reviews are - well, bad, however, I am a true true believer in the customer is NOT always right. After working in retail for years as a teen/young adult, you get to know the nature of people pretty well, so I will always want to get to the bottom of WHY they want a refund. Is it because they just don't like the scent, or is it a legitimate concern, like they noticed a crack in the jar? For me to give a refund, it has to be a legitimate reason, or a real concern. 

 

Now, if it's just that they don't like the scent, or it wasn't what they thought it was, I will offer an exchange but not an outright refund. 

 

I disagree with this statement. If people know you are new to the business, IMO they will see how far they can push you and see what your business limits are. 

100 % agree. People can sense that your eager to please.The saying of mistaking kindness for weakness not only applies here but life in general IMHO.

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What the differences in responses above highlight is one important thing: confidence

 

When you KNOW you have a well tested, proven product you can often read between the lines when someone is fishing for freebies.

 

when you are new, and not confident, giving refunds seems he right thing to do at the time. Scammers know this and seek out opportunities to exploit. If you have fully tested your products, and have adequately spent the time and money to market test the products prior to offering any for sale there should be no question about the quality.

 

i am at the tail end of a dispute wherein the customer flat out admitted they only left a bad review to get a refund because,  their words, it is customary for a shop to issue refunds for bad reviews. What a horrible corner we have have been painted into. 

 

That customer rolled the dice and lost. One outrageous review is not going to change anything on my end. people have learned how to read between the lines of reviews and will dismiss those that are clearly spiteful for no real reason other than to get paid. I am a 5-star shop and don't care to pander to a tantrum in what amounts to theft.

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7 minutes ago, TallTayl said:

I [...] don't care to pander to a tantrum in what amounts to theft.

DING DING DING - It all goes back to another thread we have on the board somewhere, and how people feel 'entitled' just because they want. Drives me crazy. 

Everyone thinks they need a participation trophy and if they don't get one, watch out, here come the tantrums and cries. It happens in all walks of life. 

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9 minutes ago, Candybee said:

Good for you TT!

 

Do you ever think of turning it around and leaving a bad review for the bad reviewer who you find out just wanted a freebie?

Etsy removed that ability a long while ago. It alo removed the ability to see other reviews left for and by the buyer. It really changed how scammers could work the system.

 

Etsy also advocates for the buyer far more than the seller. Waiting to see the response from the Abuse Team to my incident.

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One in-person incident cemented into my brain happened my second year at faire.

 

My ship was filled wall-to-wall with people sniffing, making selections and purchasing.

 

A woman walked in and yelled, " I am VERY DISSAPOINTED IN THE CANDLE I BOUGHT FROM YOU! THE WICK JUST FELL OVER!"

 

of course the shop cleared lickety split. I looked at her and said, "Excuse me?" She maintained that the wick just fell over. When I asked what kind of candle she bought she looked around for a minute and picked up the most expensive candle in the shop and said this one. It was a solid beeswax pillar. It was clear that she had never once purchased anything from my shop.

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A woman tried to scam me when I first introduced my Memory Hurricane shells. She bought one, loved it, then another, then after her second order, bought and paid for 5 more, however, said that all 5 were damaged in shipping and wanted her money back. I asked her to send pictures (as to determine if it was my packaging, or if it was the carriers fault) no pictures, insisted the box was too damaged and threw it away, but wanted a replacement for all 5 products. I asked her to ship back all the broken pieces of the wax and shells of the hurricanes that were so broken, and I would take care of the return shipping plus the shipping of the replacement items, and after I got the pieces back and could determine the cause I would replace the damaged product. 

 

I know I pack well, and I know the hurricanes I make would have to go through some really rough conditions to get slightly damaged, let alone "arrive in pieces" because the wax I use for those is so hard, it's almost like a very hard plastic. But I really tried to accommodate her request. Once I told her I would pay for the shipping for the pieces back to me to replace her damaged items I never heard from her again. IMO that's because they weren't damaged, and she decided she wanted to give more out for gifts, but didn't want to pay for them, and thought I would just send them out to her for free. 

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@Jcandleattic Im really glad you handled it the way you did. When people "test the waters" and get their way I think that empowers them and it 

then becomes a game and a challenge to them. Almost like a control thing. I saw it up close + personal once at Home Depot, this person was 

way out of control, almost unhinged and another employee actually called the police. I think people/stores are much more cautious nowadays with nut jobs

that might actually carry a gun and use it. You just don't know with people anymore. @TallTayl Wow, I can't believe that lady, seriously, WTH is wrong 

with people. Are they THAT miserable ? Im sorry both of you ladies had to experience that :( 

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perfect way to handle it JC. Again, confidence. You did everything right in the making, understanding the materials and limits, packaging correctly, etc.

 

The only thing different I would have done was require that she file an affidavit of damage with the shipper so I could begin the insurance claim process. I would send the link or a PDF of the form so she can conveniently, at her leisure, file it. After all she said the package was damaged by the carrier. At that point it is clearly an insurance claim. The shipper will require photos and/or presentation of the item at the post office. It shifts the "blame" from you to the shipper and dehumanizes the enemy.

 

moonstar, i do believe in karma. The universe has its way of righting itself. you may not see it immediately, but it does come around.

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4 minutes ago, TallTayl said:

perfect way to handle it JC. Again, confidence. You did everything right in the making, understanding the materials and limits, packaging correctly, etc.

 

The only thing different I would have done was require that she file an affidavit of damage with the shipper so I could begin the insurance claim process. I would send the link or a PDF of the form so she can conveniently, at her leisure, file it. After all she said the package was damaged by the carrier. At that point it is clearly an insurance claim. The shipper will require photos and/or presentation of the item at the post office. It shifts the "blame" from you to the shipper and dehumanizes the enemy.

 

moonstar, i do believe in karma. The universe has its way of righting itself. you may not see it immediately, but it does come around.

 

After she refused so send everything back to me, I did suggest she file a claim with the carrier as a last ditch effort - this was about a week if I remember correctly of not hearing from her after I asked her to ship things back to me. She still never responded, so after 30 days, I emailed again letting her know it was a closed case because of the non-response. 

 

It was so long ago and such a long drawn out process with this woman, I didn't want to write it all out. LOL

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I had a customer try and tell me a candle "exploded," and she wanted her money back. Not in my system, not a scent I carried, not a jar I used. Just a scammer. Nope.
Had another one when we were newbies try and tell me an entire box of votives (18), none had any scent, she had burned them all and wanted her $ back. You burned 18 votives and all were a problem, but you continued to burn? Haahaa Oh I had made 36 from that batch, I had the other 18, my favorite scent, and mine were great. ;)
Had another person tell me the candles tunnel burned. Also then told me well, I light them for about a half hour and then blow them out...OY! And the list goes on and on. True problems I always replaced/refunded. Most of those were results of damage during shipping.

 

It pays to ask questions.

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Customers say the darndest things, lol. I feel for you Flicker.

 

There was a scam not to long ago where a guy wrote actual letters to candlemakers complaining that the candle he received as a gift had no wick. he demanded a refund. That one is mail fraud, and could be investigated by the feds.

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Just now, Flicker said:

Oh the $hit I heard working for Bitter Creek would BLOW your mind. haahaa I will just say, never underestimate the stupidity of the general population! ;)

I believe this is true with any retail position. Retail is retail and people are people. never gonna change them, but you can make sure you and your business are not victims. 

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