Clear Black Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 6 minutes ago, TallTayl said: Soy farming is becoming as polluted as cotton. I would like to read articles about what you have learned if you have time to post them... and a high ho yes to finding alternative waxes. What kind of alternatives you thinking TT? Only route I see is parrafin but I thought in the eyes of customers they want more soy, even though we as chandlers know something is aloof with the wax. I see this heading towards a lot of extra explaining to customers why the rapid switch to another wax was required. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonshine Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 (edited) If customers are made aware that soy is being polluted I bet they would jump on trying paraffin or palm I have been burning so many of my go to scents and the throw is just gone on top of the wicking completely off - even with adding other stearics I would be very interested in alternative waxes and have been googling until my eyes are googled .....I need an alternative and fast, I have been experimenting with palm and I do love it but I need another option if I can't get these flames to settle better has anyone recently purchased Clarus waxes? Mine is last years so I was curious if they have changed as well having soy in the blend Edited July 21, 2017 by moonshine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldieMN Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 @coconut I would be interested in alternatives, if you have the info, and results ppl have had with them. Goldie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coconut Posted July 22, 2017 Author Share Posted July 22, 2017 17 hours ago, TallTayl said: Soy farming is becoming as polluted as cotton. I would like to read articles about what you have learned if you have time to post them... and a high ho yes to finding alternative waxes. I try to stick to verifiable sources....here is one I originally found on Sciencedirect, but our own government has it on their web site: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24491722 Compositional differences in soybeans on the market: glyphosate accumulates in Roundup Ready GM soybeans. The next really scary thing, which I think is relative to the recent changes we are seeing, is that Monsanto had designed a package of seeds and herbicide designed to work together-but they released the seed before the herbicide, so farmers planted the seed and then used old type herbicides on these beans. This herbicide was not labeled for this used and they used way too much, causing drift and damage to a lot of other crops. If you Google Dicamba, you'll find loads of stories from 2016 and 2017 about farmers using this stuff on soybeans. Farmers also used something called 2-4 D on these plants. Two states banned Dicamba, and there are a lot of lawsuits going on about these off label uses. I don't know what exactly has changed in soy in the last year or two, but for sure something has happened, and it is not good. If it can mess up wax, imagine the issues it is causing in our food chain. Next time you shop at the grocery store, read the labels and you will find soy is in almost every single prepared food on the market INCLUDING CHOCOLATE! Gasp! Now that sh!! just ain't right. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coconut Posted July 22, 2017 Author Share Posted July 22, 2017 I had to give up candle making because of my allergies, but I always used paraffin. None of my customers cared and it is fairly easy to work with. It actually is plant base. Been reading a bit about coconut wax, but some have soy in them. Of course there is palm too. The true natural waxes are probably too expensive. It is a lousy situation. I feel bad for y'all.? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldieMN Posted July 25, 2017 Share Posted July 25, 2017 On 7/18/2017 at 9:09 PM, moonshine said: My hot throw is also significantly less in this years lots....have been burning testers all day and it just doesn't seem as strong as before - pulled some tester jars made from last year of the same fragrance and so different in burn and throw - I don't even know what to say....so many years into perfecting my brand and now ?♀️ I know what you mean. It is like "where do I start?" even with a new lot of wax. I am paying the price of not testing every box of 464; won't ever do that again. As soon as I can make sure my wicks, new boxes of wax, and fragrance oils work together, I will have to figure out what to do with the candles I poured from the bad lot. Goldie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighten Up Posted July 25, 2017 Share Posted July 25, 2017 I found this thread interesting as I am just about to order a pallet of 415. I have had vary little variation with this wax, except for one batch many years ago, before I was buying full pallets. I contacted someone at GB and was told pretty much I didn't know what I was talking about. One of the things I was told was that it was formulated for a specific melt point and it should always behave as so. If the new wax behaves badly, I don't know what I will do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldieMN Posted July 25, 2017 Share Posted July 25, 2017 5 hours ago, Lighten Up said: I found this thread interesting as I am just about to order a pallet of 415. I have had vary little variation with this wax, except for one batch many years ago, before I was buying full pallets. I contacted someone at GB and was told pretty much I didn't know what I was talking about. One of the things I was told was that it was formulated for a specific melt point and it should always behave as so. If the new wax behaves badly, I don't know what I will do. As I mentioned in another post/maybe another thread, that I had problems with 464 and contacted AAK. They didn't have a problem with the Lot F that caused me problems but asked me to send a couple pounds so they could test it. I did not ask for their results. Today, I contacted them again since @Lighten Up wasn't helped. (I hope you don't mind, @Lighten Up, that I quoted you.) Here is the major part of my message: "I feel I should tell you there are many, many chandlers experiencing problems with 464 and 415 to the point of looking at other options such as the new Ecosoya products. When AAK is contacted, the person is told " it was formulated for a specific melt point and it should always behave as so". No help when they are ready to order a full pallet but need assurance that the soy will not perform as it use to. For many, making soy candles is their livelihood. It probably is a small part of AAK's business, but being told "it should be ok" isn't an answer to the problem. Who can these people contact to get help? I couldn't find a customer relations department contact." I received this response within an hour: "Thank you for letting us know that we have some customers who were not getting the help they needed! We want them to know that we value their business and their feedback on how we can improve the way that we provide information and support their efforts to make great candles. I am glad to hear that the replacement wax worked well for you and not so glad to hear that we have other customers who can't get the answers they need from us. I have contacted the head of our Customer Service Department (Carmen Lardieri-contact information listed below) and asked him to reach out to you. For new issues please contact Customer Service and they will then work together with our quality and customer innovation (R&D) to resolve wax issues as they come in."Carmen Lardieri Customer Service Supervisor AAK-US 1-973-741-5077 At least we have the correct person at AAK to contact, now. Alternately or in addition, you could contact the retailer you purchased your wax from. They need to know there is a problem and should, in turn, contact AAK. If you get nowhere with the retailer, I would let AAK know this as well. "Carmen" has not gotten in touch with me, yet; but I will let you know if/when he does. The replacement wax sent to me is working perfectly so far. It has Lot C 3/25/17 on the label. Goldie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighten Up Posted July 26, 2017 Share Posted July 26, 2017 Thank you Goldie, for the info. I don't mind at all that you used my quote. Since then, I have not had a lot of confidence in having a remedy should I have an issue with my wax. And, with buying by the pallet, that is a big investment. I do feel a little better with the new contact info. I am very interested to see how this plays out, I am both eager and afraid to order my wax now... really, can I return/exchange a whole pallet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldieMN Posted July 26, 2017 Share Posted July 26, 2017 @Lighten up I would contact Carmen Lardieri and ask him that question explaining why you have to ask it (all the problems people are having) before ordering. Goldie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighten Up Posted August 4, 2017 Share Posted August 4, 2017 Has anyone actually made contact with Carmen? I called earlier this week and left a voice mail- no return call. Called again this morning and I was forwarded to a different number and left another voice mail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldieMN Posted August 4, 2017 Share Posted August 4, 2017 6 hours ago, Lighten Up said: Has anyone actually made contact with Carmen? I called earlier this week and left a voice mail- no return call. Called again this morning and I was forwarded to a different number and left another voice mail. @Lighten Up When I read your post, I wrote this message to AAK since I was the one who posted Carmen's contact info: "Please send me contact information for someone who is actually willing to help a customer. Carmen Lardieri, Customer Service Supervisor, is not responding to messages left. Perhaps I need the name and contact information of Carmen's supervisor. I was told to pass on Carmen's information to those needing help." I received this response from Carmen's superviser: .Kelly Moughalian <kelly.moughalian@aak.com> Good afternoon Carol, I am Carmen's supervisor. Please feel free to call me or email me. Best Regards, Kelly Kelly Moughalian :: Customer Service Director AAK USA Incorporated :: 499 Thornall Street :: Edison, NJ 08837 USA m: 973-489-2110 e: kelly.moughalian@aak.com w: www.aak.com So I would just go to Kelly to get some help. After all of this, they better compensate you with replacement wax! Squeaky Wheel Goldie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighten Up Posted August 5, 2017 Share Posted August 5, 2017 Thanks so much, Squeaky Wheel Goldie, I really appreciate it!! I should have more time to pursue this next, I'll let you know how it goes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovelyscents Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 On 7/25/2017 at 5:38 PM, GoldieMN said: The replacement wax sent to me is working perfectly so far. It has Lot C 3/25/17 on the label. Goldie So does this mean any lot after 3/25/17 is back to normal? I was debating on still testing 415 and 464 in the future as part of a parasoy blend (love the creamy appearance, cold throw, richness of bakery scents, longevity and FOs seem to always mix seamlessly), but reluctant after reading all the soy issues this year along with how finicky it can be vs paraffin with oil selection. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallTayl Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 So they're basically not acknowledging they knew of a problem. They sent you a replacement case of wax as hush money? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldieMN Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 @lovelyscents When I got the replacement wax and tested a couple of fragrance oils, I posted that message as it was performing well with a nice hot throw and same wicks as I used in the past. As I continue to test, I find I have to wick down on a number of FOs. What I've learned is, I will be testing every lot/box I get from now on. @Talltayl I was happy someone actually got back to me and wanted to replace my two boxes of wax. If you are interested in getting an answer as to why the soy has changed or if they knew about it, I've included customer contact info in this thread. "Kelly" would be my choice as he/she is the director of customer service Goldie 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighten Up Posted August 14, 2017 Share Posted August 14, 2017 I'm still playing phone tag about the 415. I believe I went to Kelly after Carmen, but was passed(I believe Kelly was on vacation) to someone else who was unaware of any issues except for condensation. This person did say something to the effect that there would be no changes in the wax performance due to any different chemicals/pesticides used on the crops, as those would be resolved in the processing plant. I am now making contact with the guy at the 'wax lab'. Anyone else with issues specific to 415? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighten Up Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 After speaking with AAK and learning how the wax is processed, I finally ordered my pallet of 415. AAK did send me some wax to try, and I have started testing it, and so far(knock wood), see no significant differences. Hopefully, my pallet will be the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldieMN Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 Thanks for keeping us informed, @Lighten Up. Did you have to change wick size to get the sample to work for a good hot throw? Goldie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighten Up Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 I have not changed my wicking so far. I am testing an unscented and also burning one from my current wax -the sample one is actually burning a little cooler, but the wicking still stands. And, I am also testing 2 sizes of my most popular scent(CS Apple Harvest) and the throw was just as fantastic as always. It is burning fine so far, as long as I keep the wick trimmed. I had planned to test the sample wax more, but it's been so darn warm here for September. The new wax will be here this week, and I will be happy to report back on that, as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonshine Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 Please do let us know how it goes and the lot numbers you receive my 2 cases of 415 are crap, the throw is not like it was and burns way too hot with my normal wicking, I'm still hesitant to believe it was a fluke with so many other soy issues out there and different brands being affected as well I have not received an email back as if uet and will try calling the number today Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighten Up Posted September 22, 2017 Share Posted September 22, 2017 Just a quick little report: My pallet of 415(same date as the sample I was sent - 8/17/17) arrived and I got a couple of testers made right away. I am 1 hr in to the first burn- so far, so good. I did wick down 1 size just for the heck of it (and from my other one that was burning a little hot at the half-way point). The scent throw is good, and I am hopeful. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallTayl Posted September 22, 2017 Share Posted September 22, 2017 What wick series are you finding works well with 415? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighten Up Posted September 22, 2017 Share Posted September 22, 2017 I've been using CDs since the beginning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldieMN Posted September 22, 2017 Share Posted September 22, 2017 On 9/19/2017 at 7:53 AM, moonshine said: Please do let us know how it goes and the lot numbers you receive my 2 cases of 415 are crap, the throw is not like it was and burns way too hot with my normal wicking, I'm still hesitant to believe it was a fluke with so many other soy issues out there and different brands being affected as well I have not received an email back as if uet and will try calling the number today Since I had over a case of the 464 that wasn't working at all, I poured some test candles with smaller wicks just to see if I can salvage it. If not, I suppose I can use it for clamshells. Goldie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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