TallTayl Posted June 27, 2017 Author Share Posted June 27, 2017 18 minutes ago, Faerywren said: I started with soy because I believed the hype. When it gave me frosting and wet spots and moon crater tops AND didn't have hot throw at all, I started tweaking. Now I use a 60/40 blend of 464 and 4630. As I mentioned in another thread. I label my candles as a soy blend. I have had exactly one customer ask what that meant and when I said, "It's a blend of soy and paraffin waxes", their eyes glazed over and they bought the candle any way. No one gives a crap in my neck of the woods. I'm a full time RN and soap and candle in my spare time. I don't have time to fiddle and coddle my ingredients. 60:40 - did you have to change wicks/sizes on the blend? I am finding my C3 need bigger than a CD16 to burn all the wax in most of my scents :-O. I have 4630 and am about to do another set of line blend tests with different ratios in C3 and 415. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallTayl Posted June 27, 2017 Author Share Posted June 27, 2017 I did hear back from Cargill. They want the lot # and where I purchased (EAP). they suggest it is a handling thing, but I disagree. It is a batch problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonshine Posted June 27, 2017 Share Posted June 27, 2017 Well it appears peak doesn't have palm anymore....hasn't there been complaints they have been out of stock on many things? But it's simply just not listed anymore and I swear I saw it not even a week ago Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faerywren Posted June 27, 2017 Share Posted June 27, 2017 59 minutes ago, TallTayl said: 60:40 - did you have to change wicks/sizes on the blend? I am finding my C3 need bigger than a CD16 to burn all the wax in most of my scents :-O. I have 4630 and am about to do another set of line blend tests with different ratios in C3 and 415. I use 8 oz masons. I get good throw with most of my scents with a CD 8. Certain spicy or 'heavy' scents I need to wick up to a CD 10. My 16 oz jars start with a CD 10. The largest wick I buy is CD 12. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallTayl Posted June 27, 2017 Author Share Posted June 27, 2017 Where I hold shop in the summer many would not even ask, just wanting a good candle. but in Wisconsin enough people still believe soy to be the one and only :-/ i also sell beeswax and still, hard sell. People fear pillar candles. I've made special candle holders for them, and need to put those on display, but beeswax does so much better as a pillar where the light can be enjoyed and the candle hugged once in a while. Am also concurrently working on a container blend for beeswax, which is of course proving a difficult wicking challenge. I hpget a great burn with little throw. Sigh. If I can nail the wick on a few palm I may test market them to see how many will give it a go. Meanwhile, parasoy it is (if these 10 i made tonight work that is.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcbrook Posted June 27, 2017 Share Posted June 27, 2017 12 hours ago, moonshine said: Well it appears peak doesn't have palm anymore....hasn't there been complaints they have been out of stock on many things? But it's simply just not listed anymore and I swear I saw it not even a week ago They stopped carrying it a while back. I tried getting some from them a while back when BCN was out of stock. Luckily they got it back in stock pretty quick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcbrook Posted June 27, 2017 Share Posted June 27, 2017 10 hours ago, TallTayl said: Where I hold shop in the summer many would not even ask, just wanting a good candle. but in Wisconsin enough people still believe soy to be the one and only :-/ 2 I sell in Wisconsin too. Some of the people up in my neck of the woods are coming around to the idea of palm wax. But I still get a few that I have to explain it to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallTayl Posted June 27, 2017 Author Share Posted June 27, 2017 16 minutes ago, pcbrook said: I sell in Wisconsin too. Some of the people up in my neck of the woods are coming around to the idea of palm wax. But I still get a few that I have to explain it to. I only have 9 weekends to earn money for the year. Soy tins have been my bread and butter feeding a LOT of mouths in the off season. I don't have a lot of time to wait to convince people of something that might be better, KWIM? Easier and more profitable to go with the accepted flow. Thankfully scented beeswax melts are starting to fill in the gaps... candles as a whole are losing favor to melts. Being agile is helping us stay afloat. It is just super challenging. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcbrook Posted June 27, 2017 Share Posted June 27, 2017 (edited) I have also noticed that the melts are more popular than candles. I sell a ton of melts to 2 to 3 candles. Sorry, what is KWIM? Edited June 27, 2017 by pcbrook Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jcandleattic Posted June 27, 2017 Share Posted June 27, 2017 53 minutes ago, pcbrook said: Sorry, what is KWIM? KWIM = Know What I Mean? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcbrook Posted June 27, 2017 Share Posted June 27, 2017 Oh sheesh! Thank you. I was trying all kinds of things but I never thought of that one! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candybee Posted June 27, 2017 Share Posted June 27, 2017 7 hours ago, pcbrook said: I have also noticed that the melts are more popular than candles. I sell a ton of melts to 2 to 3 candles. Sorry, what is KWIM? Candle sales have definitely dropped. I noticed that last fall. I figured it was from people switching to melts but since I don't sell melts I couldn't be sure. BTW-- palm wax, any palm wax including container palm waxes make excellent melts. When you cool the melt you just slide it out of the melter with a push of a finger. Easy peasy and no mess! It comes out in one whole piece you can toss out! And they scent fast, super fast and strong! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joym Posted June 28, 2017 Share Posted June 28, 2017 2 hours ago, Candybee said: Candle sales have definitely dropped. I noticed that last fall. I figured it was from people switching to melts but since I don't sell melts I couldn't be sure. BTW-- palm wax, any palm wax including container palm waxes make excellent melts. When you cool the melt you just slide it out of the melter with a push of a finger. Easy peasy and no mess! It comes out in one whole piece you can toss out! And they scent fast, super fast and strong! At what temperature do you pour the palm for the melts (assuming you're using the clamshells.) My melts, which are paraffin, have been outselling the jar candles for the past 5 years or more. (I usually say a "thank you" to Sce..sy at the end of every craft fair.) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candybee Posted June 28, 2017 Share Posted June 28, 2017 (edited) joym-- palm wax has to be heated and poured at such high temps it won't work with plastic clamshells. When I make melts with palm I use metal tart molds. Every once in a while for the holidays I pour about a dozen or so different holiday scents and put the tarts in cute little open boxes to make a "tart bar." (Think salad bar.) Only the customers pick out the tarts they want from the boxes and put them into zipper sandwich bags. When I do make tarts I sell them by the buttload. I just don't like making them very often so only do it when I feel like it! Edited June 28, 2017 by Candybee 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonstar Posted June 28, 2017 Share Posted June 28, 2017 On 6/27/2017 at 0:50 PM, pcbrook said: Oh sheesh! Thank you. I was trying all kinds of things but I never thought of that one! LMAO !!! I had to google internet lingo to find out what it stood for . So your not alone on that one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcbrook Posted June 28, 2017 Share Posted June 28, 2017 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonstar Posted June 28, 2017 Share Posted June 28, 2017 Dumb question but can palm wax flakes be used for wax melts ? The kind for soap making or is it just for soap ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallTayl Posted June 28, 2017 Author Share Posted June 28, 2017 1 minute ago, Moonstar said: Dumb question but can palm wax flakes be used for wax melts ? The kind for soap making or is it just for soap ? The melt point on Palm kernel flakes used in soap is only 102*f, too low - especially in summer when they will be a puddle of oil in hot mailboxes. palm kernel flakes alone are very oily to the touch, like hard shortening. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joym Posted June 28, 2017 Share Posted June 28, 2017 3 hours ago, Candybee said: joym-- palm wax has to be heated and poured at such high temps it won't work with plastic clamshells. When I make melts with palm I use metal tart molds. Every once in a while for the holidays I pour about a dozen or so different holiday scents and put the tarts in cute little open boxes to make a "tart bar." (Think salad bar.) Only the customers pick out the tarts they want from the boxes and put them into zipper sandwich bags. When I do make tarts I sell them by the buttload. I just don't like making them very often so only do it when I feel like it! Thanks - thought palm wax might be too hot for clamshells. the "tart bar" sounds like a great idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonstar Posted June 29, 2017 Share Posted June 29, 2017 2 hours ago, TallTayl said: The melt point on Palm kernel flakes used in soap is only 102*f, too low - especially in summer when they will be a puddle of oil in hot mailboxes. palm kernel flakes alone are very oily to the touch, like hard shortening. Thank you ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldieMN Posted July 5, 2017 Share Posted July 5, 2017 On 6/24/2017 at 10:37 AM, TallTayl said: I, like many of you, have been a total glutton for punishment by sticking with soy wax for so long. Each case of wax is so inconsistent within brands from the same supplier I have to re-test my candles constantly. Have made and test burned over 50 this past month to find that most do not perform as they have so reliably in the past. we have come to accept that soy wax has issues in the looks department with tops only the mother can love. we accept the advice that we must wait weeks before knowing if a scent might possibly throw in our wax. Who the heck has that kind of time? I sell retail but make nowhere near as many candles as many of you do who sell wholesale/retail. Those of you who use many different fragrance oils, how do you manage to test every case of wax when you have to wait two weeks to check those test candles; find a problem, retest, wait two weeks, check again. . .? Goldie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallTayl Posted July 5, 2017 Author Share Posted July 5, 2017 I have learned the hard way to check each lot # with known performers and a couple of known difficult fo's. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonshine Posted July 5, 2017 Share Posted July 5, 2017 43 minutes ago, GoldieMN said: I sell retail but make nowhere near as many candles as many of you do who sell wholesale/retail. Those of you who use many different fragrance oils, how do you manage to test every case of wax when you have to wait two weeks to check those test candles; find a problem, retest, wait two weeks, check again. . .? Goldie Truth be told....I do not test every case before making sale jars - I have never had an issue ever up until now with every sale batch I make I make a tester jar, and I have done this mainly because if an issue or complaint ever came up I have a jar in that batch that I have already burned or could burn to see what's going on....honestly those tester jars are piling up because I don't have time to burn them all as fast as I make batches for sale on top of new testers for new scents to add to the line In my turkey fryer I had about a couple pounds of older cases of wax left and filled it up with the lot from march of this year and made a few newer scents I had already throughly tested and burned them again- they are not burning the same - the wicks are the same, the jars, fragrance and method - they are burning too hot in my case so I am now in the position to where I do have perform many tests again- especially the ones I have to use a CD12 in, I think the 10's will be okay even though they are not the same as before, I don't think they will get dangerous hot but of course I need to test them but the question is -will the next cases I get be the same....or will I have to go back to my normal wicks....or do I just find another blend that will be reliable and test all over so I don't have to ever do this again - I don't even know how many years it's been now since using 415, maybe 5 or 6 and I have never had a issue, I know my jars and wicks inside out and I am besides myself right now - the one thing in my favor is I do have decent stock and I don't have to do any shows like I wanted to this year but I have to make a decision fast because I'm not doing this again my customers want soy and that's my predicament, soy is what I started with about 10 years ago and I have to find a way to beat into submission or figure out a parasoy blend .....guess I will be real busy the next several months seeing I have a full time job already and this is a side thing for me which is hard enough to keep up with ? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldieMN Posted July 5, 2017 Share Posted July 5, 2017 I had this candlemaking down to only needing to test two different wick sizes with each new fragrance. Then I ran into trouble in January with a 464 lot, October 2016 date (I think) on the box. Thought it was something I did until I read other comments. Today, I'm reading many, many 2017 comments on Candlescience about problems with 464 and 415. If everyone who has problems with AAK's waxes contacts them, maybe the company will realize there is something wrong in the processing or the plants. Is this a GMO problem? Chemicals being used on the plants? Yes, I did contact them. They were very supportive working with me, but I am not sure if they found anything wrong with the sample I sent. If they couldn't find anything wrong with my sample, they may think it was my error. But if they hear from everyone who is having problems, they may look further into what is causing these problems. Goldie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jcandleattic Posted July 5, 2017 Share Posted July 5, 2017 24 minutes ago, GoldieMN said: I am not sure if they found anything wrong with the sample I sent. The problem with sending them a sample back is this: they probably won't find anything wrong, because no way would they be able to conduct the same exact tests you have done, simply because their environment is going to be different, so their results, (good or bad) are going to be skewed compared to yours. And in reality manufactures are typically not candle makers. They make the wax, sell the wax, and profit from the sales of the wax, yes, but they don't spend the hours and hours testing different scenarios in candle testing that we do, so they probably wouldn't even have a clue where to begin... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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